Discussion in 'Thread Archive' started by Cheez, May 18, 2011.
Week 3: Illinois at Oregon State
I watched the replay of that horrible interception. And this is what happened, your defensive end got into the back field very quickly and spooked me even though he was never going to get me. That is what caused me to throw the ball while running leading to the pick.
sounds plausible. I'll buy that.
This is the play we were talking about earlier tonight that resulted in a safety for the Bruins. Cougs, show it to you T3 friends and see if it compares to the example you were telling me about.
I still don't understand how that was a safety...
I think I see the ruling here (I think the refs screwed up, but here's my take anyway):
The "refs" are saying that it was recovered in the field of play, not in the endzone. The implication is then this: The arizona player recovered it outside of the endzone, carried it back in to the endzone, and was marked down before getting the ball completely back out of the endzone. Therefore: Safety
I've also got a few weeks worth of highlights to post when I get back to my apartment today.
Should have been a TD anyways!
he fumbled the ball before he broke the plane
I know but he shouldnt have! I dove like a fool and I think that caused the fumble more than anything else. Wont be diving in the endzone with defensive players anymore!
@JFace907, @recchem2000, @Cheez
Here is the NCAA rule book regarding safeties, and honestly there is no explanation for why this is a safety.
SECTION 5. SafetyHow Scored
ARTICLE 1. It is a safety when:
a. The ball becomes dead out of bounds behind a goal line, except from an
incomplete forward pass, or becomes dead in the possession of a player
on, above or behind his own goal line, or becomes dead by rule, and the
defending team is responsible for the ball being there (A.R. 6-3-1-IV and
V; A.R. 7-2-4-I; A.R. 8-5-1-I-III, VIII and XI; A.R. 8-7-2-V; and A.R.
When in question, it is a touchback, not a safety
1. When a Team B player intercepts a forward pass, fumble or backward
pass or catches a scrimmage or free kick between his five-yard line
and the goal line and the ball carrier’s original momentum carries
him into the end zone, where the ball is declared dead in his team’s
possession, the ball belongs to Team B at the spot where the pass or
fumble was intercepted or the kick was caught (A.R. 8-5-1-V-VII).
2. When a Team B player recovers an opponent’s fumble, backward
pass, scrimmage kick or free kick between his five-yard line and
the goal line and the ball carrier’s original momentum carries him
into the end zone, where the ball is declared dead in his team’s
possession, the ball belongs to Team B at the spot where the fumble,
backward pass or kick was recovered (A.R. 8-5-1-V).
3. When, after a change of team possession, a Team A player intercepts
an illegal forward pass, or intercepts or recovers a fumble or
backward pass between Team A’s five-yard line and the goal line, and
the ball carrier’s original momentum carries him into the end zone,
where the ball is declared dead in his team’s possession, the ball
belongs to Team A at the spot where the illegal forward pass, fumble
or backward pass was intercepted or recovered.
b. An accepted penalty for a foul leaves the ball on or behind the offending
team’s goal line (Exception: Rules 3-1-3-g-3 and 8-3-4-a) (A.R. 8-5
When I watch the replay, I have hard time believing the Arizona player recovered the ball outside the endzone, this simply should be a touchback. Here is a video from a T3 game, this play should have sealed the win for Ok. State with them up by 4 with less than 30 seconds remaining in the game when this played occurred. But this safety gave extra life to Texas allowing them to get the field goal to win at the gun. Side note I can defend this call based on the rule book. However, in real life this call is not made.
Illinois vs. Penn State
Week 6: Illinois at Michigan
Week 7 vs. Minnesota
In this 1st example it's complicated because the game doesn't act appropriately. Here's what I think happened:
The ball had crossed the plain of the endzone but because of the suction in the game, the player's feet were still on the ground (or established) in the field of play when the fumble was deemed as touched/recovered by the defender. This still wouldn't matter in real life as the defender's original momentum would've carried him into the endzone inside that 5 yard buffer between the goalline and the endzone. However in the game (evidently) there is no 5 yard buffer, only original momentum. The player is deemed by the game to have scooped up the ball (via suction) while being established in the field of play and then subsequently diving (where his "momentum" begins) into the wrong endzone, being marked down on contact.
With suction removed in '12 this shouldn't happen because said player will be landing on the ball instead of "scooping" it, therefore changing where the player's momentum begins.
Clearly in 2nd example the player makes a football move (by hurdling after the int) in the field of play, and the momentum from that move carries him into the endzone, therefore if he's tackled or falls down it's a safety.
But i have had numerous interceptions at or near the goal line, and I have never been called for a safety. Last night I intercepted a pass at the goal line and went into the endzone, and I started with ball on the 1 foot line. When I watch the play in question, I don't see the Arizona's player feet outside of the goal line. To me his feet are inside the goal line before he recovers the ball. As for this whole issue, I want to know why the UCLA linebacker stopped running after he intercepted the pass? If he didn't stop, he would have scored and we wouldn't be discussing this. @recchem2000 please explain
@Jayrah - that's exactly what I was trying to say, but you did it much more eloquently than I did.
I stopped running because I thought I just tipped the ball away and it was incomplete...than the next thing I know, I had picked and went "oh shit, I better start running!"
Or are talking about why I dove? I thought I was gonna get caught if that is the case and wanted to score. Little did I know when defensive players dive, they tend to drop the ball.
I am talking about right after the interception, I don't second guess your decision to dive. I have had QBs fumble the ball on dives. But going back to the interception, your linebacker catches it with ONE HAND. I was going to say he caught with the arm pad, but after slowing down the highlight frame by frame it is ONE HAND. Everyone has cornerbacks that can't catch a pass with two hands, and your linebacker catches it with one. @Cheez we may need to consult the NCAA, I think the magic has spread to Westwood. Maybe that is why the linebacker fumbled the ball at the goalline he didn't want to draw any suspicions.
I thought he just tipped it initially so I was moving on, then realize he had the ball, so thats why he stopped.
it's my hypothesis that the magic started there, and spread to Texas A&M after Coach @Jayrah witnessed its benefits. Wizard of Westwood, anyone?
Oh lord, bring your magic inquiries...we'll defend our school with everything we got!
No inquiry needed, as it is a well established fact that the UCLA basketball program used magic for years when Wooden was there. Is it so inconceivable that those practices found their way to the football program of the same school? Absolutely not - but because UCLA has a direct line to the NCAA, there is no point in debating it despite the moral hypocrisy in the NCAA honor code that UCLA / Texas A&M are violating.
When you watch the video it appears the ball is deflected and he catches, but when you slow it down he actually catches it with ONE HAND. He was like palming the ball when he caught it. When I look at this guy there is no realistic way your linebacker catches that pass with one hand. If you want to rebut my accusations with his ratings you can, but the only reasonable explanation is magic.
But the SUCTION is the issue in example 1, not the placement. Your player is deemed to have picked up the ball in the field of play because the suction initiates during the dive which the game cannot account for, so it puts him in the field of play. Since the "next" move is a dive, you are responsible (in the game's logic) for that move into the endzone, which defines a safety.
Similarly, for example 2, during an interception the correct momentum rules occur unless there is a football move made. In this case the football move is a hurdle, which establishes momentum stopped at the beginning of the move, as opposed to the ending of the steps that it would logically take to stop your momentum otherwise outside of the endzone. Therefore the hurdle is actually the move that carries you into the endzone (in the game's logic), not your steps. Since the interception was made before the hurdle, you are responsible for the "backwards" move into the endzone, which defines a safety.
Your problem is you are thinking real world physics, which clearly don't always apply in the game
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