4-2-5 Use in '11

Discussion in 'Locker Room' started by Big Suge Knight, Jul 11, 2010.

  1. Big Suge Knight

    Big Suge Knight Walk On

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    4-2-5 Use in '11

    Hey just wanted to throw this out there b/c I had not seen it discussed anywhere. Will the use of 4-2-5 be allowed in '11 with the updated blocking AI? Dont know if any of you who have the game have tried to play against it.
     
  2. JerzeyReign

    JerzeyReign #BeatOhio

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    I think all the league commishoners are going to debate that in their forum... it was the last thing I heard on any rule changes
     
  3. jdrhammer

    jdrhammer S E C Speed

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    My big question is "why use it unless the team you control uses it?" I know there are a handful of teams that run it but the power conferences don't, for the most part. I think tcu has a lot of success with it but it would be nice if it were replicated on the game similar to how it is IRL meaning a team would get ran in easier by getting blown off the ball by power running teams more often than not.

    I know there are sec teams who run a version of 4-2-5 / 3-3-5 in passing situations but we pretty much have those too.
     
  4. JerzeyReign

    JerzeyReign #BeatOhio

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    Well actually Michigan will be using a 3-3-5 alot this season. Slowly making it our base defense.
     
  5. Hova

    Hova Live Action. YiYiYi!

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    It will need to be tested
     
  6. jdrhammer

    jdrhammer S E C Speed

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    True. That's richrod's signature d, right ?
     
  7. Shino45

    Shino45 Walk On

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    This is my thinking exactly... besides TCU I don't know any team that fully runs the 4-2-5 Defense. Like you said some teams has versions of it within their playbook.

    Also I think there are only a handful of teams that runs the 3-3-5.... Michigan & west Virginia are the main two I know...
     
  8. Daplaymaker

    Daplaymaker Walk On

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    Florida ran 3-3-5 quite a bit last year.
     
  9. BDSDIGITAL

    BDSDIGITAL One Time for your Mind

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    Virginia Tech has run alot of 4-2-5 from what I remember
     
  10. Bamaboiking

    Bamaboiking Walk On

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    bama runs a variation of 3-4 and 4-2-5
     
  11. MaizeGrenade

    MaizeGrenade Go Blue

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    I love the 3-3-5 and 4-2-5, changed most of my teams into those defenses when I played online last year because most players were pass happy online and loved having the different options instead of only having the 3-3-5 nickel or either of the dime sets. Hope they don't get banned but if they do I can deal with the 4-3 or 3-4.
     
  12. BDSDIGITAL

    BDSDIGITAL One Time for your Mind

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    last year they were only banned in certain leagues. I personally never really saw anything wrong with them but alot of people did. I just hope that they play realistically this year and are not restricted. Not because I use them, because I don't really, but as far as I'm concerned the less restrictions needed the better.
     
  13. MaizeGrenade

    MaizeGrenade Go Blue

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    Yeah if someone can prove they can play realistically with the defense I don't see the problem with them.
     
  14. jdrhammer

    jdrhammer S E C Speed

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    A buddy of mine is a college dl coach and specializes in the 4-2-5. it's basically a 3-3-5 but an olb walks down to the line to act as a rushing end. I know that's not the only form of it but that's the way he explained it to me.

    He's at a d2 school that plays Valdosta st and UNA and they air it out, big-time so he needed to specialize in a passing D. He's worked with sec coaches teaching aspects of it to them to have a counter to pass-heavy teams.

    I know there are variations and I do wish the nickel packages had more depth but 4-3 and 3-4 are likely what the game is programmed to deal with.
     
  15. Drifterbub

    Drifterbub Help me hide a body?

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    The 4-2-5 and 3-3-5 were banned in every league last year due to the terrible AI blocking on running plays. They were both way too effective at stopping the run. Also, the SS in the 4-2-5 played entirely too close to the line. This allowed them to stuff the run outside of the 4 and 5 gaps but also allow them to whip around and break up deep passes.

    I'm optimistic that most of these things have been fixed. It will take a few weeks of testing before we say one way or another.
     
  16. BlyGilmore

    BlyGilmore It's All In The Hips!

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    Plus speed was waaay too important last year, there was no noticable tackling downgrade with your nickel back versus an OLB from a 3-4, and you had people controlling the FS and flying all around the field. really the 4-2-5 had no down sides.

    hopefully a lot of that is fixed this year with the speed/accel/agility changes, player sizes mattering more (so your CB is more likely to just get run over than the OLB) and blocking.
     
  17. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

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    This happens...you should see John Clay truck him some corners.
     
  18. dharvey09

    dharvey09 Walk On

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    Yeah hopefully it is fixed because I plan on incorporating it in my dynasties. The way the spread is run today by so many the 3-3-5 should start to pick up more steam and like the NFL its a copy cat game and the tops dogs all run it Alabama runs a pass defense with Rolando McClain and SS Mark Barron at Linebacker and they bring in a nickel and an extra safety (Robby Green) and run it and Tennessee ran it all game last year to counter Florida's spread offense with Tebow and effectively slowed it down completely.

    Nebraska is also running a form of a 4-2-5 as a base defense this year with Compton and Lavonta Davis at LB and the Peso position is a LB / S hybrid and than they have there two other safeties and 2 corners. I look forward to watching them play because they ran it to perfection last year.
     
  19. Mr2Bits

    Mr2Bits 352

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    The real problem that I had with 4-2-5 / 3-3-5 is what you can scheme up with the zone blitz in passing situations. Guys would play that D and sit in cover 2 or cover 3 all game and blitz the SS who would usually have a free shot at the QB off the edge. Combine that with the fact that a) that D was pretty good at stopping the run and b) 3 guys (the two corners and the FS) would never get beat deep in coverage, and we have a very unrealistic style of defense play.

    More teams are running sets of 4-2-5 and 3-3-5, but not in the way that the video game runs them. Florida's 3-3-5 was essentially a base Nickel D. Often times the 3rd LB (usually Spikes), would drop down on the line to rush the passer, with a 3rd saftey (Will Hill or Major Wright) near the line in run situations.

    Hopefully it will be fixed, but I would encourage league commissioners to only allow it if the team plays with it.

    Just one dude's opinion.
     
  20. Hova

    Hova Live Action. YiYiYi!

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    I really don't care for it, at all. Especially teams using it that do not in real life
     
  21. Keller

    Keller The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

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    Anymore feelings on this now that 11' is out and everyones been playing?

    Heres how I feel, whats the diff between the 4-2-5 and the 4-4? Theres some different zone blitzes out of the 4-2-5 but they look very similar when you really look at them. 4 down lineman, 2 guys off the edge playing close to the LOS if not on the LOS and 2 guys in the middle. The differences in where guys are lined up are minimal if you ask me.

    One main difference is obviously the plays. The other main difference is you're replacing SS's with OLB's.. If your beef is with speed, look at all the sub 4.5 LBs compared to the sub 4.5 SS's. You'll find that there are a lot more LBs with sub 4.5 speed than SS's. That being the case, running the 4-4 would seem to be overpowered as my OLBs have 91spd and 85acc out there running around LIKE SS's would in the past.

    I get what people are saying about the edge rushing etc, but I don't feel like thats an issue this year. Whether its a LB or SS blitzing off the edge is irrelevant, because the guy is going to get there if you're overloading 1 side and the QB isn't getting rid of the ball or putting guys over there to block.

    How do you guys feel about it thus far? I know I'm pretty much 100% for it but I want to see other peoples thoughts.
     
  22. Dru50

    Dru50 Still Chicago's #1 son

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    One of my dynasty teams (San Diego St) has the 3-3-5 as a base defense. I hate the defense, but I tried it out in a couple games yesterday vs the CPU and a human opponent. I saw no AI or gameplay issues with it, as I tried some of the cheese blitzes that I know worked last year and the OL had no issues picking them up. I probably won't use it, but I'm starting to think that these defenses won't present the problem they did in last years game.

    keller - in regards to the difference between the 4-2-5 and the 4-4, if you try and run a 4-4 as your base look (which I did in 2010 for part of a season since I had 4 great DL and 4 great LB's) you can get shredded by the short passing game. The OLB's may be just as fast as some SS's, but they generally don't have comparable coverage skills.
     
  23. Keller

    Keller The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

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    Take a look at some of the linebacker prospects. You might be surprised.
     
  24. lukeoverture

    lukeoverture Walk On

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    i used the 4-2-5 playbook in my first game and it didn't seem too bad. when i made bad play selections, i did get burned and my players didn't always save me. the extra safety near the line of scrimmage did force an incompletion on one play by running way out of his zone, but no problems besides that. blitzing will cause pressure, but it can easily be beaten with keeping extra blockers back and quick routes.
     
  25. T2

    T2 Smarter than your average bear!

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    Rice runs 4-2-5
     

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