Bills no huddle-offense (the real ones)

Discussion in 'Thread Archive' started by PoloMD, Oct 1, 2009.

  1. PoloMD

    PoloMD Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2009
    Messages:
    178
    Bills no huddle-offense (the real ones)

    Can i run a no-huddle offense like the real life Bills?(y)
    I dont think so right?(n)
     
  2. ChickenOfTheSea

    ChickenOfTheSea TMFL Goat Herder

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    1,353
    this would actually be fun to see done, with fatigue in the game, it would be very interesting to see who it hurt more, D or O
     
  3. Gotham

    Gotham Walk On

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2009
    Messages:
    372
    Ummm...how's's that no-huddle offense working for them?

    Maybe they don't want to huddle up and listen to T.O. bitch?
     
  4. Mags

    Mags Former MEGA PC Commish

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2009
    Messages:
    1,183
    The problem in the game is that you don't have access to your full playbook. The Bills NH, and earlier K-Gun O when Kelly was there, was designed for uptempo pace as well as to prevent the defenders from subbing. Running a NH in Madden, you don't have access to your entire playbook, which a normal NH would. Audibles could put people out of natural positions, which is illegal per our rules. You would at minimum have access to right stick audibles as well as multiple hotroutes, but you'd have to be pulling that out of the same offensive formation (unless you had preset audibles for a particular player package). That doesn't fall in line with mixing it up, and given that the game will usually cause false starts when you start doing multiple auds/HRs, that would be a problem for the offense as well.

    The rules as they stand right now allow for NH in the 2 min drills.


    But, like anything else, I'm open to discussion. If anyone wants to revisit this, chime in here...
     
  5. coachgaddy

    coachgaddy Mega 49ers, OMFL Pats

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2009
    Messages:
    1,378
    That actually would be a nice addition to Madden 2011.

    Maybe create a playbook designed for the No-Huddle offense, have the computer automatically rush you to the line after each play but instead of just giving you audibles to go thru bring up the playbook including only your last run formation with 10 seconds to select a play.

    So that means if you were in shotgun normal and defense in dime normal they would be locked on those playbooks. The offense and defense in the background would hurry to the line, a limited playbook with a countdown of 10 sec to select a play and once the playcalling screen is gone your men are already at the line for the snap. Fatigue would also be a major factor in running this offense as well.
     
  6. PoloMD

    PoloMD Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2009
    Messages:
    178
    Yeah, Maggs is right, the only way to do it is calling audibles with the same offensive formation, and that way you can´t mix it up.It would be just the preset audibles plus the right stick audibles, I just had to ask, it looks like a fun thing to do lol.
     
  7. Mags

    Mags Former MEGA PC Commish

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2009
    Messages:
    1,183
    I do like the idea though, b/c there are a lot of teams that go no huddle with no hurry-up. Just get up to the line and go from there. There is a big movement going on in college with the spread offense using this concept. Get on the ball with the offensive group you have on the field, look to the sidelines for play call coming in from coaches, run play or any number of play options.

    You could do this now if you went no huddle, but you'd be limited in the amount of plays you could call, as well as getting audibles in for each position, etc if you really wanted to change things up. It'd be a cool addition to the game for sure.

    I know fatigue really hits in this game if you go no huddle, go on a long drive, or run your RB or WRs too much. It's noticeable.
     
  8. scarface

    scarface Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    549
    Remeber one way to kinda run no huddle is just have in your mind what you want 1-2-3 plays at a time and call them fast and then hurry to the line, give the D a sec to respond... and go.
     
  9. Gotham

    Gotham Walk On

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2009
    Messages:
    372
    Yes, but the defense gets it's subs in which can defeat the purpose of the no-huddle (at least as used by the Giants/Colts), and they still have 10 seconds to pick their play.
     
  10. ChickenOfTheSea

    ChickenOfTheSea TMFL Goat Herder

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    1,353

    Exploring this outloud a little more, (as a peanut gallery member ofc) the only sub rule it might violate is WR @ X (TE or FB) which would be an issue for a D that came out in a base look and ended up with LBs covering WRs at TE, it would not hurt the D on running plays, but its definitely imperfect because like was mentioned it limits the number of plays severely, although, most No huddles, do get some subbing in at timeouts and quarter changs, plus TV timeouts, (Something missing from madden) they seem to go in spurts.

    definitely interesting.
     
  11. PoloMD

    PoloMD Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2009
    Messages:
    178
    So maybe if we find a way to regulate the no huddle offense it could be done.
    Rules like preset audibles with the same offensive formation and player package, wait for defense to be set on every play.................
    I dont know.
     
  12. Mags

    Mags Former MEGA PC Commish

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2009
    Messages:
    1,183
    I would actually argue the opposite.

    If you go NH, you have a certain personnel package (3 WR, 1 TE, 1 RB or 4 WR, 1 RB, or 4 WR, 1 TE)... you get the point.

    Whatever package you choose, you have separate audibles of different formations that use that exact pacakage.

    Here's an example. Let's say you are prepping a shotgun no-huddle package. You use a 3-1-1 package. Your 5 audilbles look like this.

    Spread pass/run
    Trips pass/run
    Trips TE pass/run
    Tight pass/run
    Empty pass

    Let's just say you have a play out of those base type formations... With each one, you have a right stick audible for a Run, short pass, deep pass and PA pass. You have the choice of 4 plays, plus the play you have assigned to the audible which should be different than the play assigned to the right stick audibles. That's 5 plays per formation. Multiply that by 5 formations and you have a no-huddle playbook of 25 total plays.

    It'd probably be easier if you did 4 WR packages so you don't need to worry about audibling and having a WR go to TE (for whatever reason that might happen).

    Still, that's a nice offensive set that lets you have a variety of plays and formations at your disposal that you can call at the line, both run/pass/screen, etc...
     
  13. scarface

    scarface Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    549
    Well with all this Ill bring the crackers as long as you guys bring the cheese.
     
  14. Mags

    Mags Former MEGA PC Commish

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2009
    Messages:
    1,183
    As opposed to the "hot route Hester to a fly" offense? ;)


    J/K Scar. Oh, and happy pumpkinhead month!
     
  15. hoytpower

    hoytpower Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    209
    LOL LOL LOL LOL!!!!!


    Soon there will be a little pumpkinhead that will grow up an be a full scale pumpkin head like her daddy and brother.
     
  16. PoloMD

    PoloMD Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2009
    Messages:
    178
    OMG u are right, i like it a lot, what do u guys think? it can be done? or do u think is cheese like Scar said?
    Hey Scar I prefeer my cheese with Nachos lol.
     
  17. ChickenOfTheSea

    ChickenOfTheSea TMFL Goat Herder

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    1,353
    when we played PC I was pretty anal about rules, (Im sure plenty of you guys would argue I was more than anal.

    But Madden 10 seems to balance most of the gimmicks, there are still nano's and Bumb-n-run is pretty harsh, with a heavy rush or blitz, but the efficiency of screens and motion and draws, can really counter even the instant pressures, I think the offense has a little advantage, speed HBs outside, (addressed with the patch) smarter DL picks.


    Anyway, I have gotten more relaxed in my approach, I dont mind seeing the wildcat, or manual movement on D, I think the Hurry-up would be fun. should probably be tested quite a bit before any league here just adopts it carte blanche. But heck, its the space of 2 minutes for a Defense to set their audibles before their weeks game against a NH team, and layout their setups. you dont get quite the variety that the offense does, but in Mags example I would have a Hybrid for run D, a base/heavyset for goalline, incase it got ugly inside, and the rest would be various nickle dime plays coverage and pressure, that could be easily modded on the fly.

    There would need to be some sort of rule like "you must be set at the line for 10 seconds if running the NH. to give the D time to get situated, but all in all deserves some testing,
     
  18. Mags

    Mags Former MEGA PC Commish

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2009
    Messages:
    1,183
    This was being discussed in another thread and I expanded on my above idea. I thought I'd share...
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    As you've seen, we've been kicking around the discussion. If I was writing the defensive version of my above post, it would be this:

    For defense, you are expected to come out with a realistic defense based on the offensive package called. For example, if there are more than 2 Wrs on the field, you should be in a Nickle Plus package (Nick, Dime, Qtr, Dollar). Depends on whether or not you'd want a LB covering a TE / 4th WR in the package.

    The on-the-line NH offense is designed to limit the ability for the defense to substitute. If you come out in a 4 WR set, and the other guy is going to sit in a 4-3 (depending on league rules) - you 'should' go no huddle to try to exploit the mismatches in personnel. It would put the onus on the defense to call a timeout, etc.

    Audibles would be more geared to Man, Zone, Combo, Blitz from a Nickle or higher defense. You could do more defensive hot routes on the fly (blitz / shift / spotlight) if the league mandated a 'wait 10 seconds' type rule just to allow for adjustments. You would have the same rules regarding audibles and players going out of position (though in some leagues, OLB at DE isn't as big of a deal as others.)

    That'd probably be how I put it forth to my league. It gives both sides equal flexibility to adjust. For the offense, it lets them take advantage of the NH, both in pace as well as keeping a defense on the field. For the defense, it would allow time to adjust on the fly prior to the snap, or force them to call a timeout to rest or get new personnel on the field. It's something you 'see on Sunday' and if we could test it enough, I'd be in favor of allowing it in some situations, similar to the Wildcat.
     
  19. PoloMD

    PoloMD Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2009
    Messages:
    178
    We should test it, and see if it can be done in the near future. If anyone wants to test it just send me a msg on q.
     
  20. gt86

    gt86 Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    394
    i think it puts the defense at to much of a disadvantage because if you come out in in a certain formation you are pretty much set in that formation. Unless you audible down and have cb's playing Linebacker etc.

    For example lets say polo comes out in a 4 wr or 5 wr set and I call a dime , or qtr formation to match. Now if he goes no huddle and audibles to a running play or even audibles down to a running play then now I clearly at a disadvantage unless I also audible down to a 3-4 or 4-3 formation. Now I have cb's playing Lber and maybe even on the Dline depending on the orginal formation I started off with. The Defense is also allot more limited on when it comes to hurry up because you are pretty much stuck with man, cover 2 or 3 or blitz. Where the offense can easily change wr's routes etc on defense it's not that easy because you now have to go to each player and hold the X button and change his coverage or assignment, except for the linebackers where you can put them in a yellow zone ot blitz but if you want any other coverage you still have to do them separate aswell. I know if I had to play vs no huddle the entire game it would really make me wonder if we are still doing a realistic football game or just playing Easo cheese style and win at all cost. I played someone in a ranked game a few weeks ago who did no huddle the entire game and it was the most mentally draining game i have played in a long time, seeing the same few plays over and over.

    I wouldn't like it at all.
     
  21. scarface

    scarface Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    549
    All I have to say is if someone does this to my team PLEASE donot bitch if I counter with my own bullshit play calling.
     
  22. Mags

    Mags Former MEGA PC Commish

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2009
    Messages:
    1,183
    There won't be any testing of it in league games... It's just an idea at this point, nothing more.
     
  23. TRudethaDude

    TRudethaDude Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2009
    Messages:
    1,639
    just to chime in id like to say the no huddle thing gets boring when you play a "no huddle the whole game with 5 plays guy", but used when needed is no problem at all as their are times ina game that call for it. secondly i hate nano blitzers just as much as the rest of the population in here does, but i like to move MY selected player around as i please prior to the snap. if im a lb i may want to cheat up for my blitz, or even cheat up to fake blitz only to drop back. with that being said i understand that its fair to all of us to have the rule the way it is.
     
  24. PoloMD

    PoloMD Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2009
    Messages:
    178
    It's just an idea, I don't have in mind doing cheesy or EASO shit, like mags said you clan have around 25 diferent plays with properly set audibles, not calling just 5 plays. And it's not unrealistic, there are real life examples of teams playng this way. And I agree that we need rules in order to play this way. I just said that if anyone wants to test on a exhibition game I'm willing to try.
     

Share This Page