Free Agency Issue #2 - Rule Committee

Discussion in 'Thread Archive' started by Big D, Aug 25, 2010.

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  1. Big D

    Big D Walk On

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    Free Agency Issue #2 - Rule Committee

    Guys should not be allowed to give unlimited salary with low bonuses. I am calling a new vote separate to Nate's thread. I don't think we are fully understanding the consequences of that.

    Right now, with the way the system is worded I can bid $25,000,000 salary with a $50,000 bonus on a guy if I want. That is totally unrealistic and will compromise the integrity of our cap system when you can have those huge contracts and then just be able to releease them for almost not cap hit at all.

    I don't think people realized they were voting for that. . .atleast I hope not.
     
  2. Emmdotfrisk

    Emmdotfrisk Working half days on my days off.

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    I am also with Dunlap here. If we don't put limitations on it a guy can sign an older player with no penalty. Think of it this way.


    I big 12 million on shawn springs. 11.5 mil base and 500k bonus. Say next season he regresses from 80 OVR to 70 OVR, then I can cut him for a penalty of 500k.......no big deal.


    On the other hand, say we make the "base" salary concrete, according to OVR. The base salary for 80 OVR is 600k. This would mean in the cap book his base is 600k and his bonus is 11.4mil. Now this is pretty damn stiff. That means if I cut him I am looking at a 11mil dollar hit. Thats not desireable at all, so odds are I am not going to bid that high on him because I dont want to have that kind of dead weight. This system will remedy Brandon Banks and other players getting contracts of 7 million dollars and make things more realistic.
     
  3. natedawg212000

    natedawg212000 New Orleans Saints

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    Then if we go with my rule where they can modify all 3, lets add a stipulation that the salary can never be more than 1 level higher than the bonus.

    If i go to sign a guy with no bonus and his salary goes back and forth between two teams and finally the guy is making 1M salary, then his bonus must be that of the 1 level below the 1 M bonus.

    follow me? that would fix that and allow guys to modify all 3 areas. The base can never be more than 1 level above the bonus.
     
  4. Emmdotfrisk

    Emmdotfrisk Working half days on my days off.

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    I have an idea....how about the base and bonus have to be more than or equal to the previous bid (in increments of no less than10k) ?

    For example;

    I bid: 200,000 base 0 bonus on Quentin Lawrence.
    Nate bids: 210,000, base + 10,000 bonus on Lawrence.
    I bid: 220,000 base + 20,000 bonus on lawrence
     
  5. Big D

    Big D Walk On

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    Mr. Loophole here with another report :D

    What about when we get ridiculous bids higher than our current 'top' default figures, which are a 3 million base salary...that usually comes with a $1,000,000 bonues.

    So in that ridiculous 55ovr WR bid war, if I am offering a $6,000,000 base salary that should come with a $2,000,000 bonus.

    And we trust me there will be even crazier base salary numbers than that, I guarantee it. We need to keep adding bonus to those high numbers.
     
  6. BRUCE80

    BRUCE80 Let the dirt just shower over you..

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    Its going to be very tough to correct it now. Moving forward I agree 100%.
     
  7. wajomatik

    wajomatik Magister De Puer De Vacca

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    I agree we have to make sure that there is some correlation to base salary and bonus.
     
  8. Winuvas

    Winuvas OMFL Jets

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    Bonuses are paid based on overall. If an overall does not require a bonus, a bonus does not need to be paid.

    What I would propose, however, is that AFTER this crop of free agency is over (once week 1 starts), the base bonus MUST be at least 10% of the base salary. That way people have to pay some bonus for FA signings no matter what.

    Also, keep in mind that cap hits are bonuses for player cut TIMES the modifier of the player cut. So if you pay 500K in bonuses to a 3 modifier player, it's 1.5 MILLION to cut him, NOT 500K.

    If you're confused, I can bring up the cap book and show you where it is.
     
  9. Big D

    Big D Walk On

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    Okay I have a simple, yet hopefully brilliant solution that would please everybody.

    How about we put MAX base salaries for the OVR ranges listed in Winuvas' default chart. Here would be my suggestion:

    0-50 $150,000-$300,000
    51-55 $200,000-$400,000
    56-60 $250,000-$500,000
    61-65 $300,000-$600,000
    66-70 $400,000-$800,000
    71-75 $500,000-$1,000,000
    76-80 $600,000-$1,200,000
    81-85 $750,000-$1,500,000
    85-90 $1,000,000-$2,000,000
    91-95 $2,000,000-$4,000,000
    95-99 $3,000,000-$6,000,000

    Owners would have to bid atleast the MINIMUM bonus for all guys in a rating 'slot', such at if he is 81-85ovr he must have atleast a $250,000 bonus.

    Now once bidding wars start, guys can only offer a base salary of what is listed above. They can increase that via modifier. However, the ONLY other way to increase it would be to raise the bonus! This is just like real life, with player max salaries, an its all about the bonus guys get in FA.

    In other words, look at this example:

    OLB S. Merriman 84 ovr

    Winuvas bids $750,000 base sal + $250,000 bonus x 3 mod = $3,000,000

    Dunlap bids $1,500,000 base sal (the max allowed in that rating slot) + $250,000 bonus x 3 mod = $5,250,000

    Winvas now wants to beat my bid, but his salary is maxed out, so the only alternative is to increase the bonus.

    Winuvas bids $1,500,000 base sal (max) + $500,000 bonus x 3 mod = $6,000,000

    ---------------------------------------------------------

    Ok, now its rare for me to get this excited about an idea of mine. . .but I think I've come up with a GREAT solution here. This is very very realistic, and would be damn easy to keep track of.

    Thoughts?
     
  10. Winuvas

    Winuvas OMFL Jets

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    My suggestions would be as follows:

    Up the maximum base salary offered to the players based on overall.

    Take OUT the rules that limit amount of bonus offerable to players. Bonuses can go up as high as they want.
     
  11. Big D

    Big D Walk On

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    Ok, with Winuvas' suggestion, here is a table with rules that I have put together.

    OVR Salary Range Min Bonus
    0-50 150,000 - 450,000 0
    51-55 200,000 - 600,000 0
    56-60 250,000 - 750,000 0
    61-65 300,000 - 900,000 10000
    66-70 400,000 - 1,200,000 25000
    71-75 500,000 - 1,500,000 50000
    76-80 600,000 - 1,800,000 100000
    81-85 750,000 - 2,250,000 250000
    86-90 1,000,000 - 3,000,000 500000
    91-94 2,000,000 - 6,000,000 750000
    95-99 3,000,000 - 9,000,000 1000000


    1) Default rosters and non-1st round rookies start with minimum base salary
    2) All FA Bids must stay within salary range, and give a minimum bonus according to chart.
    3) Bonus pay has no maximum limit

    ----------------

    This is really straighforward, and I think very easy to understand. It allows for variation in the salary, but when a guy reaches a max salary for a position and rating, your only option would be to increase the bonus. Uber realistic and very simple to understand I think.
     
  12. Winuvas

    Winuvas OMFL Jets

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    I like it. I like it a lot.

    Simple.

    Straightforward.

    Easy to understand.

    Something I'm trying to shoot for with the cap book rules.
     
  13. Big D

    Big D Walk On

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    Tried to text and get ahold of Nate, but he must be busy with the family tonight. So I'm going to use my ability as a RC member and call a vote on this chart. Jeremy and I might have a suggestion about restarting FA with all the 'mess ups' that are occuring, but we will vote on that later.

    For now just vote on if you would want to implement the above?

    I vote YES.
     
  14. Winuvas

    Winuvas OMFL Jets

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    Why not.

    YES
     
  15. natedawg212000

    natedawg212000 New Orleans Saints

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    I vote no. I like Frisk Idea. much more simple, more easier to understand. Last thing, imo, that we need is another 'chart' to follow. Simply say the contract and bonus must go up 10 K EACH bid. would that not fix it and be more simple?

    sorry i wasn't around, I had to preach tonight.
     
  16. Winuvas

    Winuvas OMFL Jets

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    Another idea that would fix issues, and BIG time fix issues for both bids and cap hits:

    Change the wording of the rule and take out the modifier portion of it.

    Cap hits would be the following:

    "Base salary of the contract is what a team takes as a cap hit."

    For trades, compare just the base salaries to determine who has to pay the difference as a cap hit. Modifiers are not applied, just the salaries.

    No confusion about modifiers. ALL players have cap hits this way.

    Of course, with this setup, the bonuses idea goes away. It's quite a radical idea, getting rid of the bonus structure of the cap book. So it's probably too radical for this setup. But it wouldn't be hard to fix based on the current cap book setup-just add the bonuses to the base salaries and make that the new "base salary".

    Crazy talk, right?
     
  17. natedawg212000

    natedawg212000 New Orleans Saints

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    You guys say this chart is simple, but I must admit, I dont get it.

    So are you saying that we are totally changing our system ? No more rating = price?

    If I bid on a 52 ov guy and both teams bid the max in his salary and bonus, who wins? Can we keep going above that?
     
  18. Winuvas

    Winuvas OMFL Jets

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    Actually, what Dunlap was saying is there is a base salary "ceiling" that, once hit, would be the end of raising base salary.

    You would then have to raise bonuses to get a player in. Which means more cap hits in the future.

    With Dunlap's idea, the rule for a bonus not being able to exceed the base salary would be ELIMINATED, thus meaning a guy could essentially get a 3 million base salary and, through crazy bidding, get 8 million in bonuses, which would affect his cap hit.
     
  19. natedawg212000

    natedawg212000 New Orleans Saints

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    So those first numbers are that range of players 'base ceiling' and where the bonus must start?

    So if i want a 52 ov player his base ceiling is 450K, at which time I can start doing Bonus and the bonus has no ceiling?

    I like it. I like Frisk also. I think dun's spells it out more clearly.
     
  20. Big D

    Big D Walk On

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    I have to be honest, I don't often propose something that I am so sure about, and so positive that everybody would be 100% behind. . . I thought this was sooo simple and straightforward. Let me explain a bit then:

    OVR is overall rating of the player
    Salary range, is what the range of base salary people can bid, min to max
    Min bonus, is the minumum bonus you must bid on a player.


    If there is an 82 rated player, then you look at the chart to find out what you can bid.

    Simple as that. You cannot exceed max salary, so lets say again for Merriman (84 OVR)....

    Dunlap bids 2,250,000 base salary + 250,000 bonus x 3 modifier = $7,500,000

    Winuvas wants to outbid me, but salary is already maxed out. This means to woo Merriman over to the Broncos, he must offer a larger bonus than me. So he offers:

    Winuvas bids 2,250,000 base salary + $750,000 bonus x 3 modifier = $9,000,000

    Get it?

    I really think this is uber simple. Honest 100%. If I ever had a proposal that I thought every single guy on this board would vote for, this is it.
     
  21. DJDunn6

    DJDunn6 Walk On

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    I vote YES on Dunlaps idea, sorry I did not contribute sooner I am not a rules guy on the board but being I am one of the cap minions I needed to vote.
     
  22. Emmdotfrisk

    Emmdotfrisk Working half days on my days off.

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    sorry dunlap but I am gonna vote for my idea haha. It seems like the chart would be too difficult to implement at this time. So definitely when bidding you have to exceed base and bonus by at least increments of 10k. Modifier is tied to depth at that position.
     
  23. Big D

    Big D Walk On

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    Being a bean counter as I want to get this fixed one way or another ASAP. . .

    YES- 3 (Win, Dunn, Dunlap)
    NO- 1 (Frisk)

    Wasn't sure if nate's was a yes or no, but we need him and Bruce to vote. Jeremy is gone until later tomorrow from my understanding.
     
  24. BRUCE80

    BRUCE80 Let the dirt just shower over you..

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    I just started to figure out what we were doing..

    That said I am ok with this.
     
  25. natedawg212000

    natedawg212000 New Orleans Saints

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    I would be fine with this
     
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