One Last Nasty Piece of Business

Discussion in 'The Experience' started by Archie Griffin, Sep 27, 2009.

  1. Archie Griffin

    Archie Griffin Walk On

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    One Last Nasty Piece of Business

    Alright, I'm looking over schedules, and should be able to put something together by this evening.

    But, before we launch the new season, we need to handle the business of over-signing in the off season. I'm going to reserve the right to hand down whatever penalty I see fit, but I want an idea what the league feels about this one. I don't think anything was intentional, but we had one team over by three, and the other over by a whopping nine guys.

    Let's have the discussion and come up with a fair deal for everyone. We cam down hard on AMP, so we can't give these guys a pass, but I'm not looking to cripple anyone, either. Firm, fair, and nothing that takes the fun away from playing here.

    Make your suggestions and give your opinions.

    AG
     
  2. JHeb

    JHeb Sooner Magic

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    Oversign by 3: Cut all 3 players, lose 15 hours of recruiting

    Oversign by 9: Cut all 9 players, lose 20 hours of recruiting

    Without going back to look at who was over by 3 and who was over by 9, I think there has to be something significant but not a season killer (as it pertains to recruiting). If this were to have been my ordeal, I would expect to lose all the oversigned players and lose some recruiting time. If I was over by just a few I'd expect a whole week of recruiting to be gone, maybe even more, maybe 15 hours.

    If I had gone over by NINE, I'd expect even more. I'd expect to lose all players and then even more recruiting time. In my mind, 20 hours hurts. Maybe it needs to be 25. That's a lot in my mind but it'd damn sure make me remember to have my settings set properly and not over offer or anything like that. The 1-7-70 would be constantly on my mind and I'd never hose it up again.
     
  3. wildcatter78

    wildcatter78 Walk On

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    Cut the oversigned players and lose some schollies.

    One thing, even though one guy signed 9 over and the other 3 over, it was the same mistake. It just happens one guy had more roster spots available.
     
  4. Archie Griffin

    Archie Griffin Walk On

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    I agree that we're talking about similar mistakes here. One team had 22-23 guys leaving, so the mistake didn't show up as big. The difference between the nine and the three is actually smaller than you might think.

    Also, these guys have already suffered CPU cuts, which can be difficult, since who we would like to cut and who the CPU cuts can be different. However, if we signed some duds in season, not having to keep those duds can be a big advantage also. It's a roll of the dice, I think.

    We're probably talking about a loss of recruiting time here. Losing time in week one can be a killer, since many of us insta-sign guys who have us at the top of their lists. Not being able to offer these guys right away will lead to losing some of them, and that is a significant penalty, especially if you're going after bonus guys who others will be chasing. It's hard to make up that ground.

    Whatever penalty I decide on will probably limit recruiting time in the first week(s) of the season. But cuts gave already been made. We could adjust the 1-7-70 to a different base number for these schools also, and leave the recruiting time alone. I'm looking into a number of options.
     
  5. DatNDaz

    DatNDaz Walk On

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    Agree with Wildcatter, it was the same mistake. With the offseason confusion we had, I don't think we need to crush them over it. It looks like all the guys were cut already (AG, did you do it, or let the CPU?). If CJ Scott ended up on LSU's roster, he benefitted from the CPU cuts. He's a good player.

    I'd be fine with 5 hours the first week for a first offense. While it's a lot of guys to have to cut, it was just one mistake that caused it, and I don't think it was intentional.
     
  6. DatNDaz

    DatNDaz Walk On

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    One other thing to point out, not sure if it warrants a penalty discussion or not. Nebraska has 18 promises made to incoming freshmen. Everybody else was ok.

    Wildcatter is new to us, but I don't think any leagues under TF allow for promises to be used. Wildcatter, what say you?
     
  7. wildcatter78

    wildcatter78 Walk On

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    Well, I got joined up into the dynasty with about 2 hours to go before you guys were going to advance the offseason and didn't have time to absorb all of the rules. In fact, this is the first time I have gone through an offseason in TF so it is all still new to me. I'm not going to argue much one way or another. It was just a case of me not knowing the rule.

    I will just state all of my recruiting was done in the offseason after all the recruits were picked over. Also not sure I was going head to head for any recruits. If I was, I can bury those guys.
     
  8. Archie Griffin

    Archie Griffin Walk On

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    I don't think it's much of a big deal, especially given the circumstances. I'll act if the league think I need to, but I'm almost thinking we should just let this be the new guy's one "get out of jail free" card.
     
  9. wildcatter78

    wildcatter78 Walk On

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    I will abide by whatever ruling the members see fit, but I WOULD really appreciate a stern warning as it was an honest mistake. The real punishment is having most of the guys I recruited take up roster spots over the next 4 years!
     
  10. JHeb

    JHeb Sooner Magic

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    Yeah, good point...Didn't think of it that way. I take back my suggestion on one being more severe than the other. Sounds like AG is heading in the right direction on this one.
     
  11. JHeb

    JHeb Sooner Magic

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    Yikes! I talked to Wildcatter the day of his acceptance into the E...I tried to catch him up on all things E but it is a lot to absorb in just a couple of hours. I'm biased here obviously, but I'd agree that this was not done intentionally and should be handled as a "get out of jail free" card situation. Take that for what it's worth...
     
  12. Colemanchu

    Colemanchu GOAT SPLITTER

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    Alright so we have three problems.
    1. Wildcatter promised guys. Probably should have done a little more research before recruiting. I'm fine with the get out of jail free card though. But...
    If we give the new guy afree pass than why not give the solid contributors a pass, I think we should and here is why:
    First off this whole thing happened because of an EA glitch that none of us had control of. Everything sprung out of whack and we had multiple threads dealing with how to solve it. I had every day off that this was happening and was on the forums and was still confused as to what was going on most of the time, I can only imagine what it was like for guys that were busy with work and or family. Maybe that's enough for a free pass.
    In dividually Bruce already gae up Oklahoma and a potential stud filled recruiting class so that JHeb could have his favorite team (classy). The team he really wanted wasn't available so he took on bama, guealden diassapears and karma hooks bruce up with his team. :) Only thing is the season is all but over and all the recruits are gone. So basically bruce already lost a year of recruiting for the betterment of the league. Survey says "get out of jail free card."
    As for jmill the guy has the unfortunate pleasure of having just gotten laid of from his job. And eventhough the time off is probably real nice its safe to assume that this league has dropped down on his worry list (and who can blame him).
    basically as much as I would like to have an advantage over and in conference opponent and a top notch recruiter who is going to be after a lot of guys I am, this was an accident and should be treated as such.
     
  13. DatNDaz

    DatNDaz Walk On

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    With Wildcatter, I figured it was just a case of not knowing the rule (for whatever reason). There's a lot to learn with recruiting and he jumped in at the most hectic time. I don't think any penalty is necessary, I just wanted to bring it up and hear his side. I see no reason for a penalty, or even a "warning".

    I understand what Cole's saying here, which is why I don't think the penalty for JMill and Bruce should be harsh. But there needs to be something. It was an unintentional mistake at a strange time (with the advance glitch), but it was a mistake nonetheless. That's why I'm suggesting only 5 hours. Won't hurt them too bad, but serves as a reminder that we all need to be sure to carefully read and fully understand the rules. Mistakes happen, but sometimes there still needs to be consequences.
     
  14. JHeb

    JHeb Sooner Magic

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    I think that is the longest post from Cole I've seen since I came onboard...Ha.

    As for Cole's points and Dat's follow-up, I can see where both are coming from and I'd have to still be on the side that there needs to be a consequence. Both Bruce and JMill have been around all this time and I'm sure read up and were aware of what was being discussed. It seems my initial suggestion was too heavy and that's fine. Wildcatter's point of their mistake being the same but looking different based on team needs, etc. changed my mind.

    Has either said anything about not putting their CPU Recruiting Assistance on "OFF"? I don't recall reading that...Would be curious to hear what was said.
     
  15. Colemanchu

    Colemanchu GOAT SPLITTER

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    I'm actually not supposed to use my phone at work so I was hiding in the warehouse trying to punch it out quick. Sorry about the punctuation Archie in that thing Archie ;)
     
  16. BRUCE80

    BRUCE80 Let the dirt just shower over you..

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    Ok,

    I am going to chime in here cause I am not sure exactally what my mistake was?

    I had my board set up. We adv a normal week so I put a few three star fallback players on it (without offers). A few of the players that showed up on my team were not on my board and my cpu stuff was set up just like everyone elses.

    The game F's up again and somehow I did something wrong? I think not. I didnt offer those players so in essance they walked on.

    How in the world should I be penalized when we all know I wouldnt have signed over my limit had I been able to complete my own recruiting without the EA bug screwing me.

    There is a huge difference here and with what has been penalized in the past. The game F'ed up I didnt...
     
  17. Archie Griffin

    Archie Griffin Walk On

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    If you set your recruiting assistance to allow the CPU to make offers, then the game didn't make any mistake. However, if you didn't do this, then it's a fluke.

    So am I reading here that you put the guys on your board, but did not let the CPU make any offers?

    We should clear this up now, because I have a 5-hour penalty in place right now, and I expect it to be followed unless there is good reason to lift it.

    That's how I see it - if the settings were put in place by the user, the penalty stands. If they were not, then the penalty can be lifted.

    But I do have a question: I had four soft commits on my board when we advanced, yet none signed. How did I get so lucky not to go over?

    And please, don't read any sarcasm into that - I'm not trying to be difficult. I just don't see how this kind of thing happens randomly, multiple times, to the same teams, yet to no one else. It just seems odd.
     
  18. BRUCE80

    BRUCE80 Let the dirt just shower over you..

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    I am not reading it as sarcastic at all AG, I understand what your saying... All I am telling you is I did nothing wrong. Did I have more players on my board then room? Yes. Did I have more scholly offers out then I had room? No.

    Did the game screw up? Yes.

    When we werent sure if the game was going to sim ahead like before I did everything that was said needed to be done. We had a normal adv so I thought just maybe we were outta the woods and added a few extra players on my board to track witout offers. I should have ended up with 67 or 68 had I done my own recruiting.

    I never went back and changed anything with my cpu stuff. And I know this for a fact.

    The OLB and 6'4 cb were not on my board and neither was one of the 3 star wrs I ended up with.

    I cant explain what happened, i really have no clue. If you think a five hour penalty is must..I can live with it. I just want my side of this out there.
     
  19. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

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    Ok, here is my opinion.

    1. Wildcatter gets a pass this time. We hashed these rules out long ago, so some of us know them by heart. He didn't, he didn't intent to "cheat", let bygones be bygones.

    2. The other two teams are the same for me. In my opinion, they either left the recruiting help on and the CPU oversigned, or they didn't and it was a glitch. We had went over about 20 times to turn off CPU recruiting assistance. If they didn't they deserve a small penalty. If they did and the game glitched then it isn't really their fault.

    So, if you forgot to turn off the assistance, man up and take your penalty, IMO losing a 4 star player or 5 hours of week one time, you pick. Otherwise, lets move on.

    Shaun
     
  20. DatNDaz

    DatNDaz Walk On

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    Jello went in and verified that CPU Offers was turned "on" for both LSU and G Tech and no one else.

    So if there is a glitch, it's that the game somehow went ahead and changed that setting for those 2 teams. I doubt it.

    Bruce, when you went in and changed the settings for CPU recruiting assistance, did you turn all 3 to "on"?
     

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