Spectator Mode Will Be Built Into G4 Consoles, Thoughts?

Discussion in 'Madden NFL Football' started by Big_FN_Deal, Mar 5, 2013.

  1. Big_FN_Deal

    Big_FN_Deal Walk On

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    I read this article when it was first posted but somehow missed these details until someone pointed them out in another thread.

    Perry said PS4 will let other players look over your shoulder virtually as you're playing and, if you allow them to, post comments directly to your screen. Friends will even be able to take over your controller virtually and help you complete a section you can't beat yourself. http://www.computerandvideogames.co...ficial-details-games-videos-and-release-date/

    I find this exciting news since people have been wanting a Spectator Mode in Madden for quite sometime and is something I thought would have happened this console gen, provided as a feature within various individual games. That's all moot now seeing as this capability will be built into at least the PS4 but presumably the new Xbox as well. So what are your thoughts on this new capability and what it could mean for Madden?

    As a gamer that is very interested in online leagues, I feel this will really help Commissioners and Community Creators monitor the type of play that goes on. I also hope this can be used to help police the wild west of online ranked through created moderating methods. Also, I used to enjoy playing online for money but stopped due to the difficulty of exposing cheaters and cheesers. Now if those type of monetary gaming sites will utilize this capability as a watchdog system to ensure fair play, I will be back on that circuit. Aside from that, I think it will be fun to finally have the ability to view other people's games, live, whether for entertainment or to scout the competition.


    (This topic obviously encompasses more than just Madden but I am not sure if the general topic Locker Room gets noticed for discussion. However, if this thread is better served there or somewhere else, I ask that it be transferred there.)
     
  2. Kidofcrash23

    Kidofcrash23 Walk On

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    Sure looks good on paper, this could end up being a mess to implement.
     
  3. I Peench

    I Peench Caught in the hustle

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    This. Can't get through a season without a few disconnects as is.
     
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  4. Big_FN_Deal

    Big_FN_Deal Walk On

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    I am curious why you see it like that when this is a capability of the PS4, not a feature offered by EA or actually implemented in Madden. What exactly do you mean by "a mess to implement"?
     
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  5. Kidofcrash23

    Kidofcrash23 Walk On

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    This is a sony feature yes, doesn't meant he implementation will be any easier or harder for that matter. Just my assumption, i think the implementation is going to be a bit complicated whether it is Sony or EA. I get the feeling that you think since this is a Sony feature that this will have a smooth implementation?
     
  6. Big_FN_Deal

    Big_FN_Deal Walk On

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    My confidence in this capability has nothing to do with the name branding, it comes from the me thinking it's something that's standard with the new consoles. Maybe I am looking at this the wrong way and need to try to find more info but I view this as I would having wifi or internet browsing capability built into the PS3. From what I understand, it's the PS4 that has the capability to broadcast whatever someone is doing on the console, so I presume like any other capabilities being built into the console it has been been tested and is intended to function properly.

    It could that the word "implement" is what threw my off about your post, when all you meant was it still remains to be seen how well this capability will actually function. Even with that in mind, when I look at this broadcasting capability in the sense of doing it with a PC, the only limits would be the specs of the PC and the speed of the internet connection. So considering I would think the specs of the new consoles can handle this, how well this capability functions would fall on each individuals internet connection.

    I hope you get what I am saying even though I might not be doing a good job explaining it. Let me try it like this, I view this capability like I do Ustream, just with it being available through G4 consoles instead of a PC.
     
  7. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

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    The implementation can be just fine, but 90% of the people in the US don't have good enough connections to stream AND play. I have 10 down / .75 down out here in the rural murica.
     
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  8. Big_FN_Deal

    Big_FN_Deal Walk On

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    I am really blown away by the potential for this and I don't think it's anywhere near as impractical for most online console gamers as some may think. I presume that most people that currently play console games online have a fast enough connection to take advantage of this. I guess I have been living under a rock concerning this kind of tech because a simple Google search lead me to this from 2011.



    It is likely very similar to what Sony is saying the PS4 will provide and I can't believe I am just now noticing this. The things in this video seem to be very similar to the things being touted for PS4, namely the broadcasting games and the instant play without load times.
     
  9. RRAHx2

    RRAHx2 Cleared for Takeoff

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    I stream with my ElGato right now and it doesn't seem to cause any problems right now. Didn't read the link, but will it let you record as well? Or only stream?
     
  10. Big_FN_Deal

    Big_FN_Deal Walk On

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    I have no idea. There is a PS4 commercial trailer that briefly talks about using the "share" button on the controller to record/upload video clips and pictures but I don't know if that can be used for whole games. That alone I think will be a great way to bring immersion to online leagues because Users might finally have a method to easily create their own highlight packages, with full audio and possibly create league wrap ups, weekly.

    That said, if the broadcast tech is anything like that shown in the OnLive video I posted, it would seem fairly easy to record a full broadcasted game from a PC or other device that can stream the video. So I am thinking that any games broadcasted from a PS4 can be watched/streamed on the PS4, PC and other devices, any of which that have recording capability could do so.
     
  11. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

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    [​IMG]

    What's yours? http://www.speedtest.net
     
  12. Big_FN_Deal

    Big_FN_Deal Walk On

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    [​IMG]

    I did notice that yours is slower than 59% of the US and mine is faster than 75% so most people in the US fall somewhere in the middle. Also in another Onlive video it was stated that people would need at least 3 down to use it, 5 down was recommended, so seeing as you have 12 down which is slower that 59% of the US, I think it's reasonable to think most online gamers could use this. Again from what little I have found out about OnLive, which seems to be similar to what PS4 is touting, it's just like streaming video, which most high speed internet connections can easily handle. Maybe there is buffering time for those watching but I don't know that the broadcaster would experience any slow down play on their end. Then again I could be looking at this all wrong and they are referring to streaming live play of offline gaming, not online, which like you are saying, might take exceptional speeds.

    I guess I will Google into this further to try to get a better understanding of the tech because I was looking at this like computer sharing. Where if I use some program to remote link my PC to another or just some share program where I allow others to see what I am doing on my computer screen, live on their computer, which doesn't seem to effect me streaming video on the internet. Me and a gf that was out of town have done that to watch an online movie together and I think Xbox Live and/or Kinect have a similar share capability.
     
  13. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

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    Upload is what that service would use. Not everyone has great upload like you.
     
  14. Big_FN_Deal

    Big_FN_Deal Walk On

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    I just recently upgraded to this speed because there was some discount but I did that computer share when I had a slower speed. I am not telling you that you are wrong, I am saying I don't know or quite understand how this works. When doing a computer share is that uploading or some other type of thing where the viewers connection is doing all the work, so to speak? When we watched the movie together, I was streaming it from the internet but have no idea what her internet connection was doing to view my computer screen. Have you ever used a computer share program with your internet connection? If not, maybe that's why we are looking at this differently.

    Here is a video for a program called Teamviewer that demonstrates what I am referring to. It seems that, like I mentioned earlier, connection speed could impact spectators viewing but not the broadcaster, outside of anything normal. Meaning if I have a slow connection, any lag I experience when broadcasting would be the same I do when not broadcasting. I guess I am asking is there a difference between general uploading versus having others remotely view my computer or tv screen?

     
  15. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

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    All connections are a two way street. Imagine a pipe. My incoming pipe is MUCH larger than my outgoing pipe. In order for me to stream video, it has to go out the outgoing (upload) pipe, as well as the data needed to keep my game concurrent.

    Understand?
     
  16. Big_FN_Deal

    Big_FN_Deal Walk On

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    Yeah I get that generally but what am referring to is this. If I go to actually upload a video to the internet, like onto some file share site, yes my upload speed makes a vast difference in how quickly I can get that done. However, in the case of remote viewing, it seems to be the download of the viewer that is paramount, not the upload of the broadcaster. To put it another way, if I stream a movie online right now to watch, how does the upload speed of the site I am streaming the movie from factor in?
     
  17. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

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    You can't get bits that aren't there yet. If you are downloading and I can't keep up delivering it you are going to hang.
     
  18. Big_FN_Deal

    Big_FN_Deal Walk On

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    Let's say I was to remote view your PC from mine and you proceeded to stream a movie, what would happen? Would my viewing lag due to your upload speed, would me viewing your screen cause your stream of the movie to be slower?

    I am thinking that if you are playing even an online game of Madden on the PS4 that your upload speed is sufficient or a non-factor in how well I am able to view it and how lag free your online game is. What I am saying is that isn't the viewers download paramount for viewing and the broadcasters download paramount for playing the online game, both being independent of each other?

    I could be totally off on this but it has provoked me to try to get a better understanding.
     
  19. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

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    It would't lag, it would stop. You can't make a video out of bits that you don't have yet.

    No. For you to get information to build a stream, I have to be able to serve it to you.

    It's not magic.

    Have you ever uploaded anything to Youtube? I can't start watching it before it gets there.

     
  20. Big_FN_Deal

    Big_FN_Deal Walk On

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    Did some Google and found this. http://www.livestream.com/userguide/index.php?title=System_requirements

    It gives the recommended specs and speeds for broadcasting and viewing using Livestream. So again it seems that most online gamers would have the minimum internet speeds to utilize this capability. Time will tell what the internet speed requirements for this capability on PS4 is though. What I was trying to understand was how upload speed effects a live stream and how much is needed to accomplish it satisfactory. Also, the other part was how broadcasting an online game would effect that game. Was just thinking out loud and discussing it, can't wait for the systems to actually drop to see how this all actually performs, it seems to have a lot of potential.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2013
  21. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

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    Minimum System Requirements for Broadcasting
    700Kbps upload bandwidth

    Recommended System Specifications for Broadcasting
    1500Kbps upload bandwidth

    Optimal (for HD Multi-Bitrate Streaming)
    5Mbps or better upload bandwidth

    I don't meet the minimum, so there's 40% of the population of the US who don't either. You don't meet the optimal (high def) standard, so neither does 75% of the US.

    No one is going to want to watch grainy footage of people, IMO. So, you'll need to be in the "Optimal" band.

    You are also forgetting that those standards are ONLY for streaming video. The bandwidth required to play your game is coming out of that pool also.

    It will be a cool feature in 5 years when more people have FIOS quality connections (RynoAid FTW), but for right now...not so much.

    --

    That said, do you forgive EA, 2K, Sony, etc. for not having streaming in games already?
     
  22. Big_FN_Deal

    Big_FN_Deal Walk On

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    I expected to see some form of that by now considering they are creating spectator sports games, so it's disappointing. Especially considering I believe this kind of capability is available in non-sports games, like Call of Duty.

    Which funny enough, leads back to the discussion about streaming capability because it seems to be already being done with COD on the 360 through something called Twitch Tv, that popped up in a Google search. From the little info I have gleaned, considering I can't get the website to come up, it seems to be doing exactly what we were discussing earlier, allowing gamers to play online while broadcasting live, which you seem to believe is impractical for most online gamers for another 5 years or so. Can't get on the Twitchtv website to get any system requirements though so not sure about that. Either way guess we will just have to wait and see how this all pans out for PS4.




    EDIT- Was able to get on the site and you are correct in reference to this kind of capability for COD because it says 3mb upload is recommended, according to this. That said I don't know if what the PS4 is proposing is along these lines or something else entirely, so guess we will just have to wait and see. 3 mb upload as recommended for Twitchtv is vastly different from even the 1.5mb recommended for Livestream, so who knows what the speed requirements will be for PS4's streaming capability.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2013
  23. RRAHx2

    RRAHx2 Cleared for Takeoff

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    [​IMG]

    I have my own channel on twitch.tv the link is located in my signature. I stream most of my league games, and I get about anywhere from 4-8 viewers on average.

    IMO if the technology is available then they should include it. I am paying top dollar for a "top of the line" console, it should give me every feature available on the market at that time.

    If Sony plans to charge $XXX for a PS4 on release whether they include the streaming capability or not, then logically the majority of consumers would want the streaming feature included still.
     
  24. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

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    Awesome for you.:) Like I pointed out above, not many people have the speed to do that.
     
  25. fuzzyl0gic

    fuzzyl0gic No new friends

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