State Of The THL (x360) Address

Discussion in 'THL: Tradition Hockey League (XBOX)' started by Fiddy14, Aug 3, 2013.

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  1. Fiddy14

    Fiddy14 THL Commissioner

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    ok guys, NHL 14 drops on September 10th (Season Ticket is the 6th).

    if we are going to do an NHL League here this year, we need a strong commitment from start to finish from all of us here at TSO.

    few things, i want to apologize for THL S3 not finishing. a season not finishing is a first for me as a commissioner. i blame myself, but i also blame the game. same old same this past year and guys are obviously tired of it. the days of playing 1 v 1 and setting up an un-ranked game are pretty much behind us.

    with that said,that leaves us with the GM Connected Mode. this mode was horrible last year. a terrible first effort by the NHL Dev Team! laggy menus, trades and waivers not going through, commish having no control over anything at all etc.

    im hoping that the GM Connected Mode wont be any worse than what we had last year. worst case is that its like last year, but has faster loading times and trades/waivers work properly. lets keep our fingers crossed this is not the case though.

    regardless we will be using the GM Connected Mode for an official THL S3.

    i will treat this like an NCAA Dynasty type set up.
    • 12 owners (possibly more/less)
    • advance twice a week (say Wednesday/Saturday)
    if they keep the scheduling being open the same, by 1 day, 3 day, 1 week, and 2 weeks we will go with 1 week. this usually means you will have 2 to 4 games open to be played.

    if you have a user vs user game and it cant be scheduled for whatever reason, it gets simmed. period! if it becomes a problem, we will look into that owner being removed or have them put team on auto pilot.

    we can wait to start this league until EA has released its opening night rosters. then plug away throughout the year.

    i really look forward to having a steady league this year, advancing twice a week, and moving on etc no matter what.

    if we get more than 12 interested, say up to 24 guys, we might run two leagues side by side. that way the league keeps a solid flow with a great mix of hum and cpu games.

    if anybody wants to add anything, feel free to comment. any ideas, etc. post them!

    thanks guys

    Fiddy
    ---

    tagging anybody that was interested and in good standing with the league.

    @Slice51
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    @publik drunk
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    @dj illmatic 23
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  2. TheCrumbIsHere

    TheCrumbIsHere Walk On

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    Sounds like a plan. :)
     
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  3. justca11mejuice

    justca11mejuice Walk On

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    i didn't think the game was that bad last year... for what it was, the GM Connected mode wasn't great or flexible, but it did a pretty good job. i finished a few seasons of it with friends and enjoyed it.

    looking forward to NHL 14.
     
  4. publik drunk

    publik drunk King of the East

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    I'm definitely down fiddy
     
  5. justca11mejuice

    justca11mejuice Walk On

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    http://www.easports.com/nhl/news-updates-gameplay/article/nhl-14-be-a-gm-and-gm-connected

    • Commissioners can now accept & decline trades on mobile devices.
    • Counter trades can be proposed directly from the mailbox.
    • The ability to accept trades directly from the Trade Details Screen.
    • Users can invite others to a league.
    • All games in the league can be seen on the Master Schedule.
    • Potential is now affected by the number of scouting visits, creating a more organic experience.
    • Difficulty can be scaled to make it more (or less) challenging to trade with the AI.
    • CPU can sign and re-sign players during the off season for the user.
    • Player swapping is easier with just one transaction in the Roster Management Screen.
    • Players develop during the season, making for a more authentic gameplay feel.
     
  6. Fiddy14

    Fiddy14 THL Commissioner

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    welcome additions to GM Connected..

    but, sadly.. as a commish, they cant throw out scores, set other user teams to auto pilot, set sliders from within the mode that stick.

    the hardcore simulation sliders are the "normal" sliders from last year. sad! as i posted about 21327834239483x's, if they would just take pass assist from 4 to 2 with those settings it would be a nice happy medium. bah!

    also, no mention now if waivers work properly. where if a guy was on waivers, the team that was last in the standings wouldn't get a guy, yet the 1st place team would. bah. no mention if injuries were toned down for games that were simmed. even if you played all your games, CPU teams losing 6-8 guys for 41 plus games was a bit much. wasnt just a team or two, it was about half the league. bah.

    the thing is, EA's track record sucks with this stuff. so we have no reason to believe it was fixed or tuned. ill cross my fingers, but im expecting to be disappointed.

    basically this year we will have the GM Connected Mode from last year, but with faster loading screens and menus, plus the stuff above that @justcallmejuice posted.

    lastly, it just seems that this series has lost its luster, with casual fans, normal fans, and the die hard fans.

    for as "fun" as this game can be, with its up and down pace, hits, fights, goals, saves, etc not many people want to play it in an organized league.

    honestly, 5 years of a full 30 team league ran on a site, turnover of say 6 to 8 owners, 40 plus game schedule.. guys were having a blast. then slowly the interest started to die down in the game and in the 1 v 1 type scheduling. i just was looking at the owner numbers, owner history, etc since NHL 07 that i have saved in leagues i ran, from leagues others ran, and its sad that the interest just isn't there.

    i swear, if we had a custom schedule option, a custom league option in GM Connected (meaning have just say 12, 16, 24 teams), and was able to use the GMC like we do now but without CPU teams it might work a bit better. plus having a site like NCAA/Madden. heck, having options is always better!

    sigh.. /rant
     
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  7. justca11mejuice

    justca11mejuice Walk On

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    that being said, what's the plan for this year's league?
     
  8. Fiddy14

    Fiddy14 THL Commissioner

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    well, the plan for here will be just a GM Connected Mode.

    keep it basic and simple..

    the league republic route is TERRIBLE for stat input. as we all learned last year.

    also, it seems that the majority of the guys i had sign up here over the past few years are not into the policy here as to using a thread for scheduling as a whole. which is understandable, but if they cant follow that then they obviously cant be join a league here.

    so, as for the GM Connected League. would need to be capped at 12 owners. with that said, i doubt we even get 12 guys signed up. the NHL traffic here is not very good compared to NCAA/Madden etc.

    ill set up a sign up thread tonight or tomorrow and see what the TSO guys want to do.
     
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  9. justca11mejuice

    justca11mejuice Walk On

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    yah, if guys can't use the forums to schedule their games, they may as well just run their own GMC with their buddies. i'm not interested in a league that just sends messages via XBL or texting to schedule games. has to be some kind of control.

    i brought a buddy in to FIFA last year who had never played in a league like these, and he was fine. it's not complicated to put your availability in a thread for a few days and set something up.

    what about doing a Google Docs type league? have the games be reported and a commish or two keeps the Google Docs files updated... we ran with that over in FIFA and worked out well.
     
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  10. Fiddy14

    Fiddy14 THL Commissioner

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    i hear ya for sure. issue is with guys like that, they were in leagues for 7 plus years at a site. main way of scheduling? email, text, live message. plus, never had to even communicate via a forum "much". it wasnt a priority on the site like it is here.

    for whatever reason they dont like it, wont ever i guess lol, so they done here since that type of rule cant be followed.

    i was in a google doc league myself in the past, some not a fan of that either.

    for me personally, if we cant have a Gm Connected website like NCAA/Madden then i want a site like leaguedaddy used to be. that guys can sign in, submit the score, check stats, standings, etc. it adds so much to the replay value of the league, the game, etc. bc its like a fantasy league on espn or yahoo.

    i found a site like i just described last year. the guy wasnt a fan of wanting others to use it bc it wasnt stable etc. well, its stable now and he is open to people using it. for a price. pay to play! doing a test run elsewhere with the site. after talking with Drifter, i figured it was best to keep things simple here with just using the GM Connected. just dont think there will be many interested. we shall see though.

    wanted to touch on the communication aspect in general, the xbox glass app is perfect IMO for scheduling. if guys dont like giving out cell numbers. if they would just update it and push messages through when they come it would be the best app to use.
     
  11. justca11mejuice

    justca11mejuice Walk On

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    if guys aren't a fan of posting in a forum to schedule or a Google Docs based league (if that's the way we went), then they don't really belong here... the guys that wanna text or IM or just send XBL messages need not apply to these parts 'round here! haha. i think guys that see it in action, like the Madden/NCAA/FIFA leagues have, they'd see the community value.

    based on what you've mentioned, if there are still glitches within the GMC mode, i don't think it's a bad idea to explore alternative options for how to run the league. maybe it's an 8-12 team league that grows for the 2nd season. maybe it's a 25 game season to start, and build a wait list for people that are interested.

    i also think that there needs to be some discussion over the settings too, because as you said, it's a Madden/NCAA first environment. no sense having the fringe guys experience an advanced level of a game that's always going to be 2nd or 3rd in their lineup. let's get more people in and having a good time, build a fan base from the ground up.
     
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  12. Fiddy14

    Fiddy14 THL Commissioner

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    we all had a great community prior, without having to be posting in forums etc. it dont bother me, but does others for whatever reason.

    we had a solid 1st two seasons here with 12 guys. communicating via texts and some schedule threads. short seasons, fun ones, but the league republic site just sucked the life out of it. plus, nobody other than the usual guys were interested. in those 1 v 1 set ups only the default online settings can be used. which last year was all star normal.

    this year its all star hardcore simulation which is last years normal. have you tried the other two levels on demo? high impact is the NHL 94 settings, no holds barred LOL, and the hardcore is last years casual.

    maybe the guys would want an all out slug fest here? use the high impact settings in a GM Connected Mode and have at it?
     
  13. Drifterbub

    Drifterbub Help me hide a body?

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    I get where both of you guys are coming from. I think with something like this you have to start simple, but the idea should always be that interaction drives sustainability of the league. It's the model that we built for NCAA, Madden, etc. If you don't have it, then the league will not last.

    We've tried different stuff for NHL the last couple of years. All have failed.
     
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  14. justca11mejuice

    justca11mejuice Walk On

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    then we need to get back to the basics and get the involvement back up... maybe the likelihood of a dynasty that carries over from year to year shouldn't be in our sights, but a good, fun league that we can build upon.

    based on the number of guys that seemed keen on the league last year, even with it being a premier league, i think it's something to work with. what happened last year that didn't work? hardcore settings too difficult? GMC being wack as hell with no commissioner control? guys not using the forum to schedule games? too big of a gap between veterans and rookies? i think all these things could come in to play, just like any league.

    maybe i'm one in a million, but i've joined FIFA leagues here and now an NCAA league - both are WAY over my head, but i'm giving it a shake and getting my ass handed to me. i've seen issues with scheduling, cheesy players and the gap between vets & rooks all come up in each league. since i'm the rookie and the leagues are well established, i've learned my lesson about working at it and practicing. if we're building a small foundation, we can't push those fringe guys away from the start. include them, help them help us grow the league.

    sorry, now it sounds like i'm on a soap box and preaching. haha.
     
  15. Fiddy14

    Fiddy14 THL Commissioner

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    NHL 13 Happened..

    prior to that with NHL 12, ran two seasons here, went just fine. 12 owners etc. no issues.

    the game is as stale! plus what i touched on above with the guys.

    maybe that model doesnt work for NHL? or we just didnt have the right group with that model in mind here?

    again, 5 years of 40 plus games, all games being played, full 30 team league etc.

    when those guys dont want to play, that speaks volumes of the game itself. not the league, not the site, not communication, its the game!

    bah..

    LOL..

    ill touch on some other things later on, but as you can see only 2 people bsing about NHL, one guy likes a few posts, and an admin chimed in with some basics (which is appreciated). again, just shows you where the game stands in my book.

    heck, wouldn't you say that most guys here at TSO would be in the casual NHL fan department? the exact base that EA makes their game for. yet those guys dont even give NHL a sniff (before ive been around and during)..

    i wouldn't be shocked that in 3 years the NHL game doesnt even exist.
     
  16. Drifterbub

    Drifterbub Help me hide a body?

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    There are plenty of people her that love hockey. I stopped following it when I went away to college as I was no longer closer to my Stars.

    I would say that Hockey has a bigger following here than FIFA does, FIFA just happens to be a bad ass game.

    You can't help how good the game is, but you can help the structure of the league and how easy it is to progress.

    A league that only gets through two seasons is not any fun for a 30-team league. Because the teams with crappy rosters don't have time to improve. What's the point of taking a less talented team and getting your teeth kicked in.

    There needs to be some goals set. How many games a season? How many seasons are we shooting for? Then create a structure to get you there.
     
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  17. Fiddy14

    Fiddy14 THL Commissioner

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    you are spot on about Fifa.

    Fifa lets you play online vs games how you want. you can set the game controls, to manual, semi, auto, a mix of all of the just mentioned. you can also adjust the half length etc 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10.

    all of what i just mentioned, NHL cant do! cant set how guys play the game control wise, cant change the passing, and cant change period lengths by minutes in vs games. just 5, 10, and 20.

    only getting through 2 seasons is not fun for any league? well, we have gone through 40 plus game schedules, full 30 team leagues, for 5 years. here, we did 2 seasons with 12 teams, and a 22 game schedule. guess how? all vs games online.

    NHL's GM Connected Mode, only allows for 82 game seasons. you cant play 29, 41,48,70, etc. 82 it is! thats the issue, if we could change the season length down to 29 or 41, man, would be awesome! but you see how even getting through 1 season is an issue, let alone 2 of these?

    with that said, i brought up the talks last year when we had the guys all signed up for Gm Connected about games and possibly a few weeks being all simmed. everyone would have had to deal with it. why do this? bc of the 82 game schedule.

    in game we have these advance options, 1 day, 3, days, 1 week, 2 weeks. this goes by the NHL Schedule. so if a team in a 2 week window has 7 games, all games are open for that advance period to be played.

    the issue? guys struggle to get all 7 games in. especially if they have to play 4 different human teams. its a tough task. if they cant meet up, an owner could go on auto pilot and let the other user play vs the CPU. but guys wouldn't do that, didnt want a user to play against the cpu of their team. the commish cant even set guys to auto pilot to let one user play the others cpu team either. commish, basically zero control.

    now, 2 week advance works best, more games to play during week. could also do 1 week advances and advance twice a week, which would be just like 2 week advance periods.

    i have it figure out with 2 week advance periods, advancing every Sunday, would take 13 to 15 weeks. then add the playoffs on to that. so another say 3 weeks. basically 18 weeks to play an 82 game season. thats around what, February 2nd 2014!

    say the 2nd season starts then, that goes until June 8th 2014, right into NCAA 15.

    thats not enough time to even go through 12 weeks of a season 3. bc the new NHL game will drop 2nd week of September of 2014.

    now after all that rambling, back to the simming stuff i brought up. if we all accepted that every other week would be a automatic sim, meaning all games get simmed, no games played at all. we then cut the league from 15 to 18 weeks in half. down to say 7 to 9, thats only 2 months. we def would fly through seasons.

    if my calculations are correct, we then would get through 5 full 82 game seasons including the playoffs. but for whatever reason guys didnt like the sim aspect of it.

    IMO, that would be the best course of action and we could get the most out of this mode.

    only issues are injuries, waivers, and trades. if they dont work properly, then that sucks the life out of it as well.

    thoughts?
     
  18. Fiddy14

    Fiddy14 THL Commissioner

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    with all that said, what is still concerning is the lack of interest in the game and a league here from guys. which is understandable bc of what those other games have to offer online league wise. im a die hard NHL fan, gamer, etc and ive lost some interest over past 2 years.
     
  19. Fiddy14

    Fiddy14 THL Commissioner

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    maybe guys be interested in the GM Connected stuff i mentioned above, if we used the 'NHL 94" sliders? the "High Impact" sliders.

    NHL 94 GM Connected
    • High Impact Sliders
    • 4 Minute Periods
    • Injuries Off
    • Line Changes Off
    • 2 Week Advance (play a 2 week advance, then sim the next etc)
    fast pace, up and down old school action..

    zero emphasis on a "realistic" gameplay experience!

    i have to say, that might be interesting.. why? bc obviously EA wants the game to play that way. they cater the game to the casual crowd, why not play like it.

    :)
     
  20. niuhuskie224

    niuhuskie224 Walk On

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    So, is there a list of who is in? Cause I would be.
     
  21. justca11mejuice

    justca11mejuice Walk On

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    there are a couple things i wanted to touch on -

    * the comparison of FIFA to NHL is legit, in that FIFA online gaming is awesome and NHL is a little more challenging. that being said, i still think setting up user games until GMC is sorted out is the way to go. this works in FIFA, it could work in NHL. yah, the games aren't customizable, but i don't think that is worthy of it being discarded.

    * FIFA runs 3-4 seasons during a release, with about 16-24 games per season (if i remember correctly). no trades, no transfers, just the updated rosters based on whenever EA does a roster update. obviously we couldn't do 3-4 seasons of 82 games, especially if we did 30 user teams. i think we need to look at how many games are realistic to get in over a week or full release - NCAA, Madden, FIFA & NHL would be comparable (i'm guessing 100 over a release, or 2 a week).

    * NCAA has limitations on 12 users per dynasty, so not all 12 games are user vs user. same could be said if we did an 82 game NHL schedule with GMC. have 12-16 users and go from there. the NCAA league i'm playing in has a date set out for each advance, usually 2-3 days away, depending on user games. why couldn't you do 1 week advances every 2-4 days, depending on the amount of user games required? if guys are posting their availability in the forum and one guy is negligent, just remove him so the other owner can get his game in against the CPU. it's not ideal, and not giving the commish the ability to put someone on auto-pilot is ridiculous, but we gotta work with what we have. the key remains to have the league focused on scheduling in the forum. and that's only if we went with the GMC mode.

    i think that it's likely that there is a decent following of NHL here on the forums, even if they're not posting in this area or weighing in. once the game comes out next week, people will be interested.

    one thing i can guarantee is that i will not be joining any league (NHL or other sport) if there's going to be automated simming of my games (play 1 week, sim the next). i could go undefeated in my games (unlikely, but possible) and the CPU go winless in theirs (unlikely, but possible) and now i'm sitting at 41-41 to end the season? no thanks!

    it may be too early to tell what stuff is going to be included in the final release of the game until we see it. last year we had high hopes and they failed to deliver. this year we're thinking the worst and they may have made significant improvements that we're not fully aware of.

    end of the day, i would vote this way:
    1. GM Connected mode if everything works like we're hoping it would
    2. Vs games (10 min periods), custom schedules, 2-3 games per week, use Google Docs or League Republic
    3. GM Connected mode similar to last year and accept that there will be some issues with it (removing guys who don't schedule, sketchiness with waivers & injuries, etc.)

    Fiddy - like i mentioned, i'm able to help as co-commish if you need it. but if you don't feel like there's a chance for a league to run, i'm more than happy to take a crack at it. i've enjoyed my time over here, in the FIFA league and the NCAA league, and want to see the same growth for NHL.
     
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  22. justca11mejuice

    justca11mejuice Walk On

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    sorry, forgot to elaborate on the games per season and how many seasons that Drifterbub mentioned.

    so if an NHL season is 82 games, we'd likely only get 1 season done if we did the full season (GMC or custom schedules). this would fall in line with what other leagues would have over 4-5 seasons (17 games * 5 seasons for Madden/NCAA / 20 games * 4 seasons for FIFA).

    but, if we did a custom schedule for only user vs user games, using Google Docs or League Republic, you could do 36 game seasons and have 3 seasons during one release. i gotta believe that's realistic. 12 team league, 3 games vs each opponent, top 8 make the playoffs and do best of 5. 3 games or one playoff round each week, puts you at about 14-15 weeks per season (give or take based on holidays and stuff).

    you wouldn't be able to do trades, but with user vs user games, you'd have the up-to-date rosters (maybe a couple weeks behind) that you wouldn't have in GMC, which is a little more realistic.

    unless you can limit the total amount of games or have only user vs user in a custom league with GMC, i think the custom schedule is the way to go.
     
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  23. Fiddy14

    Fiddy14 THL Commissioner

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    ill touch on your touches lol..

    *yeah, sucks NHL doesnt have the customization and dare i say fun factor that Fifa does. the base is there, maybe the devs get it there next gen?

    *im fine with running user vs user leagues here, like we did for 2 seasons. 22 to 24 games etc. have 2 to 4 games open per week. its great having the updated rosters during the year. the GMC mode dont allow for that, obviously. ill say one thing, league republic sucks for hockey. i know first hand, its brutal. as is there support system.. LOL

    *GM Connected 12 users etc. 1 week (tick) advances 2 times a week? just use the 2 week (tick) advance 1 time a week then. i understand not wanting games simmed like i proposed. but going to what Drifter was stating, getting involved deep into the mode that is something that would be a must IMO. but see, he going off of what NCAA/Madden offer, every week they advance 2 in game weeks. that obviously allows for a full season within 2 months. i see his thought process. if we went with how i had it figured out before, the season would last 15 to 18 weeks with no automatic sims. that would let us get in 2 full seasons. which again, id be fine with.

    *as for the NHL following, been here since 12/6/11. what you see is what ya get members wise. 8.. 8 is the number of TSO guys who have signed up to play in the NHL Leagues here along with the referrals i brought with me from elsewhere. out of those 8 so if there is a following, i have yet to see it. not much chatter in NHL section either if guys were interested. of those 8, 2 drafted a team, then didnt sign into the league. 1 confirmed to be in league, missed his draft pick, then didnt respond to anything even though he is on the site. 1 up and left the site, and 4 others drafted a team, signed into the league, then decided to back out after a while.

    *dont matter if its a few days prior to season ticket release or a few more away from retail release next Tuesday. i just dont see the support from the members here for an NHL league. with that said i hope im 100% wrong and guys come out of the woodwork.

    *vs games being 10 min periods, id have no issue with that at all. especially when it would be say 2 to 4 games a week. but mostly just 2 a week!

    *GM Connected, im hoping we get more commish control than what we had last year. but IMO if that was the case we def would have heard about it bc it was something a lot of people complained about. like i said above, im fine with this mode if we go the 15 to 18 week seasons. could get 2 full 82 game seasons in for sure with dedicated guys.

    *id be fine with any help you want to give as a co-commish etc. no issue with it at all.
    -----

    im up for whatever, but the interest here in an NHL League is almost non existent. hope that changes over the next week or so!
     
  24. justca11mejuice

    justca11mejuice Walk On

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    i was mainly thinking about 1 week advances because it would open 3-5 games in a week with CPU games mixed in there... some weeks we could advance the next day if everyone had CPU games and could bang out 3-5 in one night. if there are user games, it may take a little longer to get them coordinated.

    but if you had 2 week advances each week, some guys would get their 5-7 games in over the first night or two, then have to wait for 5 days for the league to advance. or they'd have to try and coordinate 5 user games in a week, with limited flexibility. that's just where it gets challenging. if you can limit the amount of user games per advance, it probably makes for an easier/smoother experience.

    if LR sucks balls (i've used it for soccer and it was alright at best), then we could setup a google doc... i did it for soccer and worked out pretty well. one person (or a couple people) would have access to editing the file - put in scores in one tab, then the goals/assists/PIMs/saves/GAA in the team specific tab. there's a stats tab that calculates and sorts the leaders for goals, assists, PIMs, saves, GAA, etc. i'd have no problem setting something like that up and managing that with daily (or every couple of days) updates.
     
  25. Fiddy14

    Fiddy14 THL Commissioner

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    yeah, thats why i was saying a 6, 8, 10, or 12 user dynasty would be ok. that way the user vs user games is limited. especially if at 8, could have 2 user teams in each division.

    im just not a fan of google docs, no real reason why. ha.

    been bsing the owner of the site below for a long time now. if we would do a user vs user league, this is what i would want to use. his is a ps3 league!

    www.LeagueCentral.net/NNL

    whats the kicker? pay to play, just like league daddy was, just like we did at the unnamed site run by the unnamed admin LOL.

    i have zero issue paying to play and having that type of access. but IMO, with the lack of interest that would just be a waste.

    check out this other ps3 league, this guy said no to letting anyone else use his set up.

    looks just like the NHL's site.

    http://www.cnhl-ps3.com/
     
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