TMFL - Improvement

Discussion in 'TMFL' started by Shaun Mason, Jan 28, 2013.

  1. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2009
    Messages:
    24,887
    Featured Threads:
    5

    TMFL

    I've been thinking about this for a week or so (since the draft).

    I feel there is a bit of discontent about the direction of the league. Some how people have gotten the impression that I don't want to hear complaints. That is simply not true. I am always more than willing to address LEGITIMATE issues. Keep in mind that everyone has a different standard set in their mind for what is acceptable and what is not. That's why I am ultimately the arbitrator and the person who sets direction for what is kosher and what is not.

    At any point, if there is an issue with someone's behavior, on or off the "field", I want to be the person dealing with it. No more do I want people blasting people in chat or elsewhere. No one has the authority to do these things except me. Bring your issues to me, and I will deal with them. As far as game play goes, many, many people have recorders for their games. Bring me examples I can show the league to teach people what is right and wrong. Complaining with no resources for action is worthless, but using examples to illustrate what we should be doing collectively is a useful tool.

    A couple of concrete things I want to address and ask your feedback on:

    • To address the Keller draft issue:
      • I hate the fact that the issue was even an issue. To the point: Keller had an unfair advantage and ended up with what I consider a disproportionately good draft. I had someone in the league chart the draft for me though and while Keller ended up with quality picks on a slightly higher frequency than everyone else (not enough to be any different than a lucky draft), the league was fairly balanced in the distribution of players with high or superstar development. Keller did however reach up above projection far more than average. I feel at this point that the advantage he had isn't one that will effect the balance of the league. I also am hesitant to punish someone for being honest about having information others didn't. Going forward, I think that Keller has learned a lesson from this. I hope everyone has. Next time we have this issue I am not going to tolerate it.
    • The draft in general:
      • A couple things. First, I over reacted to losing my draft picks and I was an asshole to Danthraxxx. I'm human like anyone else, and I made a couple of bad decisions. I've since said I am sorry and I know Dan is gracious enough to forgive me going forward.
      • Overall I would say that I can tell the majority of people didn't use the draft guides. There are a couple of guys I will keep an eye on next time. To prevent any speculation, under the criteria I've set for that check, I would be included. I had two picks after I returned from my internet being out where I was in a rush and grabbed two players well above their projection. In my defense, my draft board was a mess and I just tried to grab two players I thought looked good.
    • Gameplay complaints:
      • I'm starting to hear a lot of "through the grapevine" complaints. My direction: Be direct. This whispering stuff is like your wife hinting to you. If you have an issue, bring it to me so at least I'm aware of it. I've had a couple people tell me they don't like playing someone. Unless I have a trend, I can't take action. I'm half tempted to bring the game play reviews back (though they are a ton of work).
    Finally, I want to have an open discussion. What can we do better? Is their anything impeding your ability to enjoy the league? We are all adults, we should be able to discuss things without petty bickering.
    Also, I will be posting another thread shortly for some Madden 13 going into Madden 14 feedback.
    Thank you,
    Shaun
     
    • Like Like x 6
  2. SimFBallCritic

    SimFBallCritic Walk On

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2012
    Messages:
    886
    Nice post Shaun Mason. As far as the gameplay reviews I don't think that is necessary, like you said we are all adults and we should act accordingly. I think it will be easy for you to determine if you are getting complaints about the same guy/guys.
     
  3. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2009
    Messages:
    24,887
    Featured Threads:
    5
    While we are on the topic, I've notice you making more of an effort to schedule on the forums. I know it has been a point of contention for many people that have felt that I give you and AzureEffect a bit of a pass on things. It hasn't gone unnoticed that you guys have improved. Everyone hated having to tweet you guys to schedule a game.
     
  4. SimFBallCritic

    SimFBallCritic Walk On

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2012
    Messages:
    886
    Yeah, I've made it a point to be responsible and considerate to others. It's my responsibility to be active on the site if I'm going to be a part of this league.
     
    • Like Like x 6
  5. Keller

    Keller The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2010
    Messages:
    13,939
    Not much for me to add really. The only thing I will say is that high scores are again getting too frequent. Has anyone looked at our playcounts/total snaps per game lately? I'm wondering if we cant try and shorten things maybe a tad to try and bring scores down.

    I just wish more people would run the damn ball. Maybe we need to make run blocking more effective to incentivize it? I don't know what the answer is, but I hate seeing all these 50-48 scores. Knowing that I'm going to play people like that ever so slightly zaps a little bit of fun out of the league for me. Its not a huge factor but I definitely enjoy the low scoring games much, much, much, much more.
     
    • Like Like x 5
  6. PAgamer07

    PAgamer07 We're the ship without a storm

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2009
    Messages:
    22,921
    Keller the issues are not related to quarter length. Thanks Shaun for bringing this up. I have some things Id like to discuss, but as it is a Monday... work is my primary focus.
     
  7. The Richuation

    The Richuation Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2010
    Messages:
    9,510
    http://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/passing-play-pct


    I pulled my stats for JAX over the first 3 games of the year (keep in mind, I have lost all 3 games and have been trailing for much of them)

    48 offensive plays per game
    61% pass
    39% run

    Based on last years stats, that would place me around 8th in pass/run %
    The 48 plays per game is almost 12 plays less than the last team int he NFL.

    Based on this, I'm inclined to think the issue is yards per play.

    Blaine Gabbert is at 11.8 yards per ATTEMPT, which is about 4 yards more than the NFL leader last year.
    The league as a whole is at 9 yards per attempt, which is about 2.5 yards per attempt more than the average teams in real life.
    http://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/yards-per-pass-attempt

    The league as a whole has a 59% completion rate, which is right on the money.



    --------------------

    Bottom line as I can see is the number of plays cannot be raised, due to passing yards per attempt. The success rate is on the money, but the amount of yards is too high. I'm not sure how you fix that via sliders.
     
  8. The Richuation

    The Richuation Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2010
    Messages:
    9,510
    What I will say is that on a personal level, this makes me think I need to balance run in better and run shorter routes.
     
  9. Kasper

    Kasper The Ghost Himself

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2010
    Messages:
    12,536
    I wish we played on All Madden- IMO, we would get better reactions from defenders defending the pass, and guys would maybe try to run more. I know the last time TMFL tried All Madden it was hated, but just a suggestion.
     
  10. Kasper

    Kasper The Ghost Himself

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2010
    Messages:
    12,536
    Regarding the league as a whole, I wish there was more content. Part of that I direct at myslef, because I haven't gotten my Draft Insider thread up for this season- but again just something I would like to see.
     
  11. Keller

    Keller The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2010
    Messages:
    13,939
    There is no way this number comes down to where the TMFL wants it to be. Its been discussed quite a few times.

    I'm not saying I don't agree with you, I'm just speaking from experience.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  12. PAgamer07

    PAgamer07 We're the ship without a storm

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2009
    Messages:
    22,921
    The first thing I have to say is that although people don't want to be known as a complainer, or just don't want to be dragged into any disputes... things don't get better unless you speak up. As Shaun mentioned, through the grapevine talk or taking an occasional jab in a game recap is not going to solve a problem.

    What will solve the problem is sending a PM to Shaun, myself and Fuzzy. If you have video evidence, that always helps. But if you don't have it, the issue is still taken seriously. If the same people are being complained about over and over, then we know we have a problem.

    Although no one wants to revert back to the post game surveys, we don't want you to feel that the commisisoner team is apathetic. Because that's not the case. There just aren't being enough (if any) formal complaints filed.

    We all know what we should not be doing in a sim league of this caliber. We've been here long enough to identify it. So if you have a problem, it needs to be brought to the attention of the commissioner team. I am sure everyone wants to stay in this league, and will adapt their gameplay to conform to what is expected.

    Things I am seeing and/or hearing about:

    • Unsportsmanlike gameplay which includes running up a score, stat whoring, or just being a douche in a win or a loss or when someone wants to discuss a gameplay issue during a game. Under no circumstances is name calling allowed.
    • Going full on retard when losing. We all want to win, I get as upset as the next guy in a loss. Unfortunately you still have to play like the game is played on Sunday. Even when you are losing. These are long games. By running the ball and playing sound defense, you can still score 2 or 3 TD's in the 4th quarter. There is no need to be going 5 WR and no huddle when down a couple of TDs in the 2nd or 3rd quarter. They don't do it in the NFL, so don't do it here. IF you can't make up that deficit by the 4th quarter, or can't stop your opponent, maybe you should just chalk it up as a loss, play your backups and move on.
    • Not mixing up play calling. This does not just encompass run/pass ratios. This involves a helluva lot more. If your route tree involves excessive curls and corner routes, you are doing it wrong. There are dozens of routes receivers run. Use them. This also includes when losing. If your only route trying to come back when youre losing is corner routes, youre doing it wrong. Blitzing every down, calling the same defense excessively. That sort of stuff all falls under not mixing up your play calling.
    • Excessive cover 2 man press. This is a very over-powered defense and should NOT be your primary defense. Mix it up. Adding in shading just makes this even more over powered.
    • Excessive rollouts. We have the scrambling under control it looks like. Guys arent taking off immediately, but Ive been hearing of some really lame rollouts. You shouldnt be rolling out to the hashes on a play action pass or similar.
    • Running outside. We all see it. Hit the hole the play was designed. An occasional bounce outside is fine, but this shouldnt be your first move. 3 or 4 yards per carry is acceptable and will also keep the scoring down. You dont have to hit a home run on every run play. This includes calling only outside runs. Mix it up here too!!!
    • Taking advantage of the AI- If you move a player on defense, you control that player. You should NEVER be moving a defender and then control someone else. This includes motion. You must allow the defender a chance to adjust if you run manual motion (not the motion that is built into the play).
    These are the biggest issues I personally hear about, but only from a few people. We all want a fun, sim experience and things only get better if you speak up.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2013
    • Like Like x 4
  13. The Richuation

    The Richuation Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2010
    Messages:
    9,510
    I don't doubt it's already been looked at. Just pointing out that this is the glaring number.
     
  14. SimFBallCritic

    SimFBallCritic Walk On

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2012
    Messages:
    886


    Great post PA. We all need to be held accountable for how we play. I try to mix up man and zone quite often, I never use man cover 2 press. On some occasions I may run a little more man on a series then zone if it helps to take routes away, other than that I try to mix it up based on how my opponent is playing.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  15. PAgamer07

    PAgamer07 We're the ship without a storm

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2009
    Messages:
    22,921
    I also forgot to mention the high scores...

    Here is the one thing that I never forget with Madden. It is very offensively focused, and incredibly easy to make a big play on someone by something as little as one missed tackle.

    There are two ways you can prevent this...

    1. Stop blitzing so damn much. The more guys you send, the more guys that are open on a route. You also won't have deep safety help in most cases.
    2. Safeties! They are there for a reason. It is extremely rare for a safety to be blitzing! They should be playing back to PREVENT the big play.
    The guys that always play good defense do both of these. I've seen them. Shaun's team is one of the best defensive teams out there. You rarely see him blitz and if you do... he still has deep help. If he isn't? Those two safeties are always back in coverage.
     
  16. Keller

    Keller The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2010
    Messages:
    13,939

    The only thing that I thought of when you said this was this.... if you are running the same defense all game, you are going to get scorched. I understand that a lot of people like Man 2 (which automatically has press built in.) BUT if I KNOW I'm going to see man press, I know how to beat it. If someone needs help or ideas, let me know. Or hell, ask any of those high flying offenses how they do it, they probably know better than me my offense is mediocre.

    The key to mixing in any defense is disguising it and changing when you call it and when you call something else.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  17. SimFBallCritic

    SimFBallCritic Walk On

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2012
    Messages:
    886

    Good point. I would say play the strengths of your defense, for example I don't blitz my safeties since I play with the Vikes. If I played with the Steelers I may send Troy on a blitz or two because that is their play style. Believe it or not things like that matter in M13, I've tested that theory playing ranked online matches. I hate playing ranked matches online because of the cheesing that goes on, but I utilize it for testing and practice purposes.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. TEClemson53

    TEClemson53 Walk On

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2010
    Messages:
    6,485
    The only issue I have and it could just be me but anytime my opponent is down , any margin whether it's 3, 7, 10, 14 etc etc... the run is abandoned. In the 2nd half, if you're down double digits, sure I understand but this is in the 1st half where people will just go 4-5 wide's and get this "I gotta score in 5 plays or less" mentality. I just think some people are a little quick on the trigger to abandon the run game, but getting 2-3 yards a carry isn't all that bad.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  19. The Richuation

    The Richuation Walk On

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2010
    Messages:
    9,510
    I'm not in favor of saying press all the time, but with the passing numbers what they are, should we be policing coverages?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. PAgamer07

    PAgamer07 We're the ship without a storm

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2009
    Messages:
    22,921
    Yes. Playing over powered coverages excessively and not mixing up play calling are not "sim".

    The problem is the routes being run, combined with poor defensive play calling by opponents as well as other factors.
     
  21. MoonBBad

    MoonBBad http://twitch.tv/moonbbad

    Joined:
    May 22, 2010
    Messages:
    5,739
    I think I have heard a bunch of times people saying something to the extent of:
    "Zone sucks, I'm not running it anymore, I'm running all man."

    There are a bunch of people who say that the man schemes esp the man 2 under are overpowered, yet people say things like that statement and it largely goes ignored.
     
  22. Philstyle3005

    Philstyle3005 Walk On

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2011
    Messages:
    2,481
    I personally enjoy damn near everything about the league. The thing I think we do lack is content that Kasper touched on, and I'm at fault at that as much as anyone. Now that I'm finally getting settled into my new position at work, I've tried to make myself a little more noticeable on the boards and will try to add content where I see fit.

    I think the sliders are really good where they're at, so no problem there.

    As far as complaining about someones gameplay, I think the best thing to do is bring it Shaun's attention, but not only his, I think you should mention something to your opponent through PM. If you approach someone the correct way, I don't see it being a problem. Saying something on the CB is just asking for trouble though.

    Also everyone should remember to do their game recaps. During the Playoffs it seemed like it was a struggle at first, but then everyone started to come around.

    All that being said, I think this is the best league on the site and I'm sure everyone in the league is willing to do whatever they can to make it even better.
     
    • Like Like x 5
  23. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2009
    Messages:
    24,887
    Featured Threads:
    5
    The YPP stat is exactly why I adjusted the time down. The issue is that people run deep routes too often.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  24. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2009
    Messages:
    24,887
    Featured Threads:
    5

    And if I don't have safety help it's because I know your receivers can't beat my defenders OR I know I am going to get pressure. Rarely do I give up a home run because I sent too many. I will however call an aggressive blitz, see the matchup isn't likely to succeed, and audible to something more conservative.
     
  25. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2009
    Messages:
    24,887
    Featured Threads:
    5
    For the final time:
    • I don't think Man 2 Under is overpowered. Run it all game against me, I dare you. If you don't know how to beat man press practice. If you are mainly running long deep routes (like many of you do) of course you are going to be troubled by man press. The route tree you chose is already long, add the amount of time it takes to break the press and you are going to get sacked. Opponent running man like crazy? Run drags, curls, slants, etc until he stops.
    • You should be running a proportionate amount of zone. Anything more than 60/40 either direction is too much. Why? Not because either are overpowered, but because they are easy to read and get ripped. Learn to bait and disguise.
     
    • Like Like x 3

Share This Page