Too early for next offseason?

Discussion in 'Thread Archive' started by weblink21, Feb 7, 2010.

  1. weblink21

    weblink21 Walk On

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    Too early for next offseason?

    Now that we have gone through our first offseason, do you think it is too early to start working on next years plan? We know SO much more now. I have some ideas and I remember we were coming up with some good ones during the offseason as well, that we put on the back burner. IMO, I think it would be a good idea to get things done in time for discussion between us and then releasing it to see what users think. I think that it is very important that we have this offseason run as smooth as possible. Let me know...too soon or should we get going?
     
  2. Winuvas

    Winuvas OMFL Jets

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    I don't think it's ever too soon to start discussing it. The sooner we can have a solid plan in place, the smoother things will go.

    I know one thing for sure: if we do a live draft like this year, it has to be four rounds only, maybe 5. 4 hours for a draft is very tiring. That was the closest thing to work I have had to do in this league, and that includes trying to keep up with the cap book. It was fun; don't get me wrong. It was just a LOT of work.

    I'll throw in a couple of opinions here as well:

    1. Free agency cuts need to be done before draft, but free agency should not start until after the draft. Either that, or free agency cuts need to be done, and free agency needs to have its first "big spenders round" done before the draft. Either way is fine, but with both so close together this year it was almost impossible to keep the cap book straight.

    2. Owners cannot cut below the Madden minimum of 45 players. They also cannot cut below roster minimums either, unless it's retirement purposes. (What I mean is like having 0 FBs in cap book, but Madden will not allow you to have 0 FBs) Having to bug owners to cut players that other teams have signed was, quite frankly, ridiculous.

    3. I like the idea mentioned from another league about having a team bid maximum of 3 bids. This would definitely keep free agency in control a bit as teams would have to bid aggressive from the get go as they only would get 3 shots to get their guy.

    Just some ideas I thought about this morning. Ring in if you like.
     
  3. natedawg212000

    natedawg212000 New Orleans Saints

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    no, lets keep this thread and start our discussions.
     
  4. natedawg212000

    natedawg212000 New Orleans Saints

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    From winuvas' ideas:
    1. I dont know if you can hold off Fa's until after the draft. Guys like myself did it right and use Fa's to fill holes and draft to get BPA. I do think we should give at least 5 days from start of Fa until draft this way all big players are gone. I also think it will help with some of your other suggestions that I am moving to now.

    2. Absolutly, 110% agree. They MUST cut their team to 45 players. They MUST not cut below a madden minimum (1 qb, 2 rb, 1 fb, ect.). Unless a retirement happens, they can not fall below the minimums. We also need to figure out what those minimums are. I know a madden minimum is 2 qbs, but I was able to go through the whole offseason with 1 qb. So we just need to see what the offseason minimums are.

    3. I REALLY like that idea. I didn't hear that any where before, but that should be one of ours for sure. This would really really really be a great move, just like the trade limits were.

    Other suggestions:
    1. Only 4 rounds on the draft for sure. Other than that it takes way way too long and this would add some cool rookie free agents in the Fa's.

    2. No draft day trades. Way too confusing.

    3. If you are not on mumble and just don't want to be (cade was having issues, but some guys just didnt get theirs working) and you didnt send in a list, then we are NOT chasing you down on AIM, and we will pick for you automatically.

    4. Be more strict and have a board system figured out for a better time between picks.

    Other than that, I don't have anything right now.
     
  5. Big D

    Big D Walk On

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    My suggestions to improve next offseason. . .

    FREE AGENCY:

    I don't like the idea of forcing teams into a maximum of 3 bids in FA. There are a couple things wrong with this, mainly that the team who always bids first on a FA gets screwed (as they now only have 2 bids left while everybody else has 3).

    I propose a simple rule. . .you cannot bid more than you have cap space available. This will solve a lot of the issues we had last year, and should keep bidding more in check.

    I also think free agency should be before the draft as I agree completely with what Nate said about this.


    TRADES:

    We need to elect a panel of 3 board members (and 3 board members only) to review all trades. Their decisions will be final. We had too much bickering when all 7 of us where involved. We need a more streamlined review process.

    Also, let's clarify the rule that in multiway trades you only take a hit for each different team you get items from. In other words, if its a 4 way trade, but I only got 2 players from 1 team then it only counts as 1 trade.


    DRAFT

    1) If you aren't on mumble and don't have a detailed list to us, the board will make picks for you.

    2) We give them EXACTLY 2 minutes from the time we 'pull' them into the draft pick room to make their pick in the first and second round, and 1 minute after that (we used 1 minute, then 30 seconds for this year. . .thats too short IMO for a live draft) . One board member will keep the time, and give them a 1 minute, 30 second, and 10 second warning. Once that time is up, we are strict on the board members will then pick for them, no exceptions.

    3) One board member is responsible for updating the Draft Database and reposting it after every round with all the rookies who were drafted taken out of it.

    4) One board member is reponsible for updating the forums with a list of draft picks.

    5) Nate signs all rookies to their teams again. . .this worked great!


    MANDATORY CUTTING

    I really really liked the idea of RFA tags. I was sad to see that go. It still allows teams to match offers to keep talent, but the less talented teams still have chances to pick up talent as well.

    I propose we make a minor tweak to the system we used this year. We force TWO cuts of your top 10 players, however 1 of them will be an RFA. We put these in a separate thread. Once bidding is done teams have 24 hours to match the bid and keep the player.

    This way, teams who keep their cap under control are rewarded again.


    OTHER

    1) You can go below 45 players in Madden. . . I was able to go all the way down to 39 players with no problem. I don't think we should restrict teams to staying above 45. Also, I don't think we can force teams to keep the roster minimums on their teams with your 'required cut' system. I mean if my aging FB is in my top 10 then I should be able to cut him.

    2) Teams should have to update THEIR OWN cap book. They would use a copy of the one Winuvas created, update it, and send it back. All the board would have to do it now double check their numbers. This REALLY streamlines the cap book process and will save headaches.

    3) We work the waiver wire forums to have subforums for each position. Again, this will make things much easier and more streamlined.
     
  6. Winuvas

    Winuvas OMFL Jets

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    I tend to agree with you on most points. The three bids deal was from one of Cade's posts, I believe. If I'm quoting the wrong person please correct me. It's from another league but I think it's a fantastic idea.

    As long as free agency (the big spenders round) has a gap before the draft, that will suffice. I can live with that as long as there is a decent gap (48 hours would be enough from after first bids are won).

    As far as the three bids part, however, that will require a LOT of monitoring. We'd need at least 2, maybe 3, people to monitor free agency during this time and we have to be FIRM on this, if we go to this type of setup.

    I do agree with draft stuff as far as people not on Mumble. If they don't have the want to create even a small draft list (10-15 players), then we'll pick for them and they'll live with what we get them. We'll need to figure out a way to update a draft board better than we did this past go around. I am open to doing AIM as a supplement, or just doing away with Mumble, whatever will work better.
     
  7. natedawg212000

    natedawg212000 New Orleans Saints

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    IMO this would force teams to be careful with what they do and how much they bid. If I wanted to bid 40 on Edwards, then my first bid shouldn't be 10, I should be bidding 30 on my first bid. I like it, and since its a discussion again I will say, I think its a cool ideal to try.

    Sorry, but I personally hate this. Its my job to mess with my cap and I should have the ability to massage my cap how I need to during the offseason as long as my team is ready to go come week 1.

    Personally I dont like this idea, but I could be open to it. Why do I hate it? Because it takes FOREVER and really sucks, but I am willing to give it a shot if the rest of the board wants too.

    Correct, however many teams you get items for counts for that many trades. I love our trade restrictions, it just needs to be better watched to make sure teams don't go over.

    What I liked about our changes is it made the offseason MUCH MUCH MUCH more simple. The draft was so much work, I personally don't know how much I want to tweak what we decided to go with. I am open to it, but its a LOT of work.

    I will fight this pretty hard. I agree with what your saying, but we will NOT allow teams to get to 'zero' players at a position. If you want to cut your FB as one of your 'top' cuts then you better have another FB on your roster. IT IS WAY WAY WAY WAY too hard for me to manually cut and sign players. It confuses everything and makes it hard. We will NOT do this again this year.

    Sounds great on paper - bad bad bad bad things come of this in reality. People won't put the work into correctly. Someone will screw it up and screw it up bad. The cap book needs to stay in the least amount of hands as possible and we need to do what we need to do to make this easy on winuvas. I am totally against this idea. Most owners are idiots and the cap book is way too important.

    We won't be doing sub-forums. The owners of the forums said its a ton of work and will really confuse the look of the forums and we would ended up hating it. They will stay as is.
     
  8. natedawg212000

    natedawg212000 New Orleans Saints

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    You guys maybe right on this. I think its a great idea, but it maybe a TON too much work. So lets keep discussing. I am all for making FA's easier without doing a draft.
     
  9. Winuvas

    Winuvas OMFL Jets

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    I'm too lazy to do quotes. But here goes:

    1. The three bids deal. The main idea against it (which makes sense in my opinion) is that the opening bidder only has 2 bids left. My devil's advocate is this: if I bid high enough, no other bidders may come to play and I won't have to worry about cashing in my 2 other bids. If I had bid 30 for Braylon Edwards as an opening bid (which is what I was willing to pay maximum for him), I doubt many teams would have come in with a bid. Basically, it's like playing poker: play aggressive with a strong hand, and play soft with a weak hand.

    2. Trade panel. I like the idea of a trade committee actually. I think one of those three people (three was the magic number mentioned) should be the commissioner, who would be the untying vote in any trade arguments. Also, if a trade committee member is part of the trade being talked about, then a backup guy should be set up as well to step in and replace that member (to ensure an unbiased vote). So a total of 4 people on the committee: the commish, two board members, and an alternate.

    3. The draft we had was pretty good. It just needs some fine tuning. We need to get the draft order before we sim the draft....lol....that was a pain. Four rounds is enough, and I agree with Dunlap: strict time management. I think though we NEED a draft guru guy: a guy that has the list of players down pat, and has a master list of overalls so that way we know who the best overall player is in case as a board we have to pick players. I can make a spreadsheet with that information (basically another tab to add like I did tabs on the English Draft Database), but I was honestly too busy to update it constantly.

    4. I was under the impression you couldn't cut below 45 players in Madden. If I'm wrong, then as long as people do not cut below roster minimums at all positions (which would be a minimum of 1 player per position, I believe), I could live with that.

    5. Cap space = maximum bid. I don't like that idea as a way to manage bids in free agency. I much prefer the 3 bid deal, but I'm open to hearing other options as well. Just don't like that one, Dunlap. Sorry.

    6. RFA. I loved the idea until we started confusing all the less active owners. This sounds horrible, and I don't mean it to, but those RFA rules confused the owners that may not be all that bright. The quick changes, while a big coup here, made it simple, straightforward, and easy to understand. I would LOVE to put the idea back in, but I don't see a way to get it in where people can grasp it easily. I do like what you proposed with an extra cut above the average as an RFA, but I think in an effort to be more realistic, we're going to be more confusing.

    7. Cap Book. I would LOVE it if everyone could grasp the cap book, update it like I do, and every owner be responsible, open, and honest about it. But let's be real: not every owner is created equal. These guys HAVE access to the cap book and still get their cap numbers wrong. It isn't a complicated process to work with the book if you have any computer sense or experience with Excel. Yet people can't get the book straight. Putting it in their hands is crazy. I'm not saying that I am perfect, but if people update the front office threads properly, my books should never be off. THAT is what we need to crack down on is the postings in the front office thread.

    8. Multiteam deals. Yes, the idea of multiteam deals is for every team you get items from, that counts as a trade to the 4 trade maximum. So if you are in a 4 team deal, but you only get a piece from 1 team, you only have 1 trade out of 4.

    That should take care of most comments here. Let me know if I need to ring in on anything else I missed.
     
  10. Winuvas

    Winuvas OMFL Jets

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    Bucs bid #1

    As far as bids go, why not put it in the owners' hands, if you think that is a good idea:

    When you do a post, even as a reply, but the bid number on that player in the title of the reply. Like what I did for this reply. If the FA monitors do not see that in a reply, that team is banned from any bids on that player.
     
  11. natedawg212000

    natedawg212000 New Orleans Saints

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    good idea winuvas
     
  12. weblink21

    weblink21 Walk On

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    Trying to catch up. This snow has my internet hit or miss the past few days.

    - Free Agency - I don't like RFA or Franchising players. I never really understood the point of the Franchise tag. It was basically just not making a cut IMO. You had to release him, but then you could bring him right back. Was the same as just not cutting him to me. I am in favor of the idea that Cade brought up in the offseason that the other league he is in uses. I was in it for awhile and it went very smoothly. It summed up to making 3 cuts - 1 premium, 1 player in 70's and 1 in the 75's. Also, I liked the idea of the 3 bids. The league that he is in also does this and it went VERY smoothly. Please do not think me referencing this other league is any disrespect to this one. I just like the way they do these few things with FA and then have been around a long time. I will post both ideas that I like in my next post. Let me know what you guys think.

    - Trade panel is a great idea IMO. Three should be the number. That number allows for a vote that will result in a unnamimous vote one way or another. I actually feel like the commish SHOULDNT be a member of the panel. I think it should be 3 members of the board with Nate stepping in if someone one the panel is involved in the trade. I think we should set it at 1 day to review and then people MUST respect the decision of the vote.

    - Draft - IMO Mumble made it more difficult. The draft ran as smooth as possible thanks to all of your hard work, but we can make it smoother. I think a simple chatroom for all drafters would have been better. It was very difficult to track of what was going on. I would also like to set a deadline for making draft trades. We will need atleat 24 hours to finalize the draft order. The trades being made soon before the draft caused some confusion.
     
  13. weblink21

    weblink21 Walk On

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    Player Contracts:

    Each season teams will also have to release 1 "Premier Player" to Free Agency. Determining your "Premier Player" is simple...

    -Total the ratings of your top 10 players not including K/P's

    - Subtract 50

    - Divide that number by 10.

    - You will have an average most likely between 80-95. If you average is 88.3, you'll have to release a player rated 88 or higher as your "Premier Player".

    This will guarantee each year that at least 32 highly rated players will be available in FA.

    Once all teams have released their "Premier Player" they will also release at least 2 players to help fill the FA market. Each team will be required to release:

    - 1 player rated 60+

    - 1 player rated 75+
    Again, this will add 96 players to FA, for a total of 128 players added to FA each year.

    Teams will update their Transaction logs at this time to show their Mandatory 3 FA's they released, including the cap number as well.

    When filling out their sheet they would fill in as an example:

    Bills Current Cap: 318
    Bills Current Players: 52

    The Bills release:

    CB Terrence Mcgee - 90 (10)
    WR R.Parrish - 82 (8)
    TE D. Schouman - 72 (6)
    DT John McCargo - 68 (4)

    Bills Current Cap: 290
    Bills Current Players: 48

    At this point you have released all the players you are required to release.

    *you CANNOT release your kicker, punter or fullback as a mandatory release.


    FA Bidding

    The way FA bidding will work is the person who makes the first offer on that player will create a thread on our FA Bidding board with that player's name and position. The thread should look like this:

    QB Philip Rivers 93 (10)

    This shows the players overall rating as well as his cap value. It's important to note the cap value because previous FA's could be different. Jamarcus Russell could've been released the season before and signed for 12 cap points even though his rating is only worth 8 points. Also include an asterik so people know he is a previously negotiated player. Example:

    QB Jamarcus Russell 83 (12*)

    Now that the thread has started you could make your bid. When you reply to the thread you are simply going to put your team's name and your bid. Example, under the River's thread:

    Kansas City Chiefs - 12

    This is saying even though Rivers is worth 10 points, you will bid 12 points of your cap to sign him.

    Once the thread has started teams have 48 real hours to bid on that player, and no team is allowed more than 3 bids on a single player.

    What does this mean? Well it means if you really want a player and have been outmatched twice, your 3rd bid will have to be pretty convincing so no one else bids on that player. Here's an example of a bidding process:

    Thread Title: QB Philip Rivers 93 (10)

    First Bid - Kansas City Chiefs - 12 (SAT AUG 1ST 12:30 PM)
    Next Bid - Oakland Raiders - 14
    Next Bid - Tennessee Titans - 15
    Next Bid - Kansas City Chiefs - 16
    Next Bid - Oakland Raiders - 17
    Next Bid - Jacksonville Jaguars - 18
    ---40 HOURS HAS PASSED ---ONLY THE CHIEFS, RAIDERS, TITANS, JAGUARS MAY BID----
    Next Bid - Kansas City Chiefs - 20 (*KANSAS CITY HAS NO MORE BIDS*)
    Next Bid - Oakland Raiders - 21
    ---48 HOURS HAS PASSED ----BIDDING IS OVER----- (MON AUG 3RD 12:30PM)

    In this case, the Raiders will sign Rivers for a 21 point cap value, expensive, but for a premier QB, it's considerable.

    Once a player is released the bidding process starts over again. Rivers would start at 10.

    All Free Agents must clear a 48 hour waiver period.

    Lock-In Rule:

    There will be a Lock-In rule applied to FA bidding. The period to which a player may be bid on is 48 hours beginning with the first offer. The Lock-In rule states that after 40 hours no other team but the teams that have already made an offer may bid on that player.

    This is to prevent teams from waiting in the shadows as team's bid against each other, and then coming in to the final hour or so and out bidding everyone else.
     
  14. natedawg212000

    natedawg212000 New Orleans Saints

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    I am not for doing the add up, divide, subtract, thats all just wayyyy too confusing. I like the way we done it this year to be honest.
     
  15. Big D

    Big D Walk On

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    Yes, this years system would be better than the one Web proposed IMO. Again, if you force teams to cut players over a certain rating (rather than an average rating) you are harming the bad teams while helping the good teams. I've went over this before, so I won't go into a long winded explanation

    Also, that free agency process that was just explained was pretty confusing. Also, if its just a 48 hour window to bid, what to keep me from making the initial bid, then just waiting until exactly 47 hours and 59 minutes have passed and then make the winning bid. Thats a pretty big loophole.
     
  16. natedawg212000

    natedawg212000 New Orleans Saints

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    ya. i hate that idea too dunlap. the first league i was in had that and it was freaking stupid and wrong.
     
  17. Winuvas

    Winuvas OMFL Jets

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    You can cut down in Madden online down to 30 players. You have to have 2 players at the following positions, it looks like:

    WR
    CB
    DT

    Every other position is required to have 1 player per. So there is our guidelines for cuts: No cutting below 1 at every position but the ones above, and those require 2. Can cut down to 30 players if you want I would reckon but man that would be tough to field a team that is decent.
     
  18. weblink21

    weblink21 Walk On

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    I have been on AIM talking to a few owners just to get their thoughts. I have been asking what they think is the thing that they would like see us emphasize the most. Almost all of them said that trades is something that needs to be fixed. I had a few that said they are were getting out of control. Most were the usual suspect trades and "board" seems to get special treatment" which has been discussed alot already so I am not trying to reopen a wound here. I just think that we really should discuss trades alot during the season. Very important to the league IMO.
     
  19. weblink21

    weblink21 Walk On

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    What do you think about putting a "tag" on players based on their ratings. I hvent thought it all the way through yet so please bear with me. I was thinking something along these lines.

    Players:

    95+ OVR= 15 points - PREMIUM
    90-94 OVR= 10 points - PRO BOWLER
    84-89 OVR= 8 points - STARTER
    78-83 OVR= 7 points - SOLID
    70-77 OVR=6 points - ROLE PLAYER
    59-69 OVR= 4 points - BENCH
    45-58 OVR= 2 points - ******
    1-44 OVR= 1 points - ********

    Draft:

    Top 5 - PREMIUM
    Top 10 - PRO BOWLER
    Top 20 - STARTER
    1st round - SOLID
    2nd round - ROLE PLAYER
    3rd rounder - SOLID

    We then put some kind of restrictions on trades. If you trade a PREMIUM player, you must atleast get one PRO BOWL player/PRO BOWL pick in return. If you trade a STARTER, you must atleast get one SOLID PLAYER + one ROLE PLAYER. We could use these as guidelines and take some of the "but this guy is better in the game." We can say, "according to the rules you must get a ***** player back." I know it is my idea, but I really think it could sort a lot of problems and would be a good solution.
     
  20. natedawg212000

    natedawg212000 New Orleans Saints

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    hum. thats an interesting thought. problem is, and it may not be a problem, some of my guys are very low ranked and I gave up way higher ranked guys but I feel my players are better. Ingram is a low low low rated TE but hes super fast and has great hands. He's a great TE. My lb's all are low rated, but super fast and i'd take them over almost any lbs in the game.
     
  21. weblink21

    weblink21 Walk On

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    You keep Ingram out of this!!!! Hate that guy! lol

    Thats the only thing that I am having a problem figuring out. What about the players that really are better than the overall rating. hmmmm
     
  22. natedawg212000

    natedawg212000 New Orleans Saints

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    Ingram did pwned you this week! ;)
     
  23. weblink21

    weblink21 Walk On

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    OK, I have been thinking about this. What if we factored in the potential of players in trades. I am still just kicking things around in my head, but what we bump a players ratings up if they have A or B potential. This way, if you are trading a young player (like Ingram) to get a veteran back that is better in ratings, we add some points to the younger player. Let;s say we give 7 to a player with A and 4 to a player with B

    For Example:

    Team A (Chicago) trade:

    QB Jay Cutler 90 - PRO BOWLER (90-94 OVR)

    Team B (Jets) trade:

    QB Mark Sanchez 81 - SOLID (78-83 OVR)

    Now on paper, the trade looks uneven **enough** for people to complain. The Jets look to have gotten the better QB. Now since Sanchez has A potential and has the chance to be better in the future, we add 7 pts for the A. Now it looks like this in points:

    Team A (Chicago) trade:

    QB Jay Cutler 90(10) - PRO BOWLER (90-94 OVR) = 90 (10 pts)

    Team B (Jets) trade:

    QB Mark Sanchez 81(7) - SOLID (78-83 OVR) + 7 pts A bonus = 91(10 pts)

    What do you think? Too difficult? Changes?
     

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