UF - FSU Thread

Discussion in 'The Experience' started by Basis4aDay56, Oct 31, 2010.

  1. Basis4aDay56

    Basis4aDay56 Walk On

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    Based on that, any discussion that needs to happen, do it in here. If there are no issues, that's fine. Keep the scores thread for scores and quick banter about the games.

    Play nice! :thumbsup:
     
  2. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

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    Amen, LOL
     
  3. dakota7

    dakota7 Former Blue Chip Recruit

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    Here's the deal, I saved some replays, watch them when you have time. I can't post the link, I'm at work and the wire doesn't work.

    My problem last night with gators was excessive QB scrambling. I felt he called pass plays and planned on taking off with his QB...specifically 4wr verticals or streaks. The first two highlights were at the end of the first half. Gators led the drive off with the first scramble. On the second, he let the clock run down to 10 seconds and used his final timeout. In my opinion, he was setting up a hail mary situation......he was just across midfield. Knowing I'd have a prevent or 3 deep coverage, he took off in hopes of getting into field goal range.

    The third highlight was on the first possession of the the second half and occured on 3rd and long. I paused the game and asked if he was going to do this everytime. He replied that I was "playing 2 deep press man coverage, what else should I do?"...............try calling a pass play that takes advantage of man coverage?? and not cheese me with 4wr verticals and have your QB take off.

    There was no pass rush on these plays.........and therefore no reason to break the pocket.

    He did this one last time, in the fourth quarter after I had punted back to him and he needed to run some clock. EA wouldn't let me save that one.

    I don't understand why we have rules that we don't follow. Gators is always quick to point out the things other guys do wrong or things he finds questionable, but then when he operates in a gray area its ok. I played gators season 1 and he threw to Demps out of the backfield 6 times for well over 100 yards. Demps was his leading receiver. He justified that by telling me it was what my defense was giving him. Now his QB scrambles 4 times on pass plays for over 60 yards and its ok because I was playing cover 2. There are rules on this website and this community when it comes to gameplay............I try to follow them out of respect to everyone else.
     
  4. dakota7

    dakota7 Former Blue Chip Recruit

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    One more thing pissed me off.....

    I wanted to go for it on 4th and 2 just across midfield with about 6 minutes left in the fourth and I was down 5. I called my play and he had the balls to pause and tell me this wouldn't happen in real life. Well, if this is a sim league, why do the rules say "while trailing in the 4th quarter, you may go for it anytime"??

    I let the clock run down, took the delay and punted. Again, out of respect to him.
     
  5. GoGators

    GoGators GT: KSherm

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    I'm at work so I can't respond in detail to this right now, but I will when I get home. till then, please refrain from commenting.
     
  6. Basis4aDay56

    Basis4aDay56 Walk On

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    COMMENTING!

    :p
     
  7. Hova

    Hova Live Action. YiYiYi!

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    Dakota you seem to have a major problem with people running with the QB, I see nothing wrong with these as he makes he read and then runs.

    When you drop everyone into coverage and do no account for the QB running he SHOULD run. You have to respect the QBs ability to run. If this were madden 05 and he was running streaks then running with the QB it would be cheese but its not and EA gave up something called contain. If you contain ONE player on your defense then you will stop 90% of this. This is the same problem you had with my run, you are not respecting the ability of the QB to run because you think it is cheese when it's not... Cheese would be hiking it INSTANTLY taking off, rather than making a quick read and taking off.

    If he makes his quick read and sees you spying I guarantee he does not run.


    as for the 4th down I think it would be legit according to the rules but I commend your respect for what the other guys thinks
     
  8. dakota7

    dakota7 Former Blue Chip Recruit

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    Hova, this isn't about your run. But since you brought it up, I've had other people agree with me and tell me your run was total crap.
     
  9. Hova

    Hova Live Action. YiYiYi!

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    and Shaun told me the run was fine

    If there is nothing explaining it in the rules it is obvious why unless we have made a mistake and overlooked it.


    There is clearly a HUGE difference of opinion here on what is allowed and not allowed. Needs to be a clearing up of this by shaun because like I told you before dakota I see this all the time and It is not cheese to me, you are not respecting the QB to run so he runs.
     
  10. Hova

    Hova Live Action. YiYiYi!

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    And this is clearly the same type of mindset I had in my run

    1. You make 1 read

    2. Next You see the huge gapping holes with nobody spying and everybody 10 yards back in coverage

    3. You run like they would in real life
     
  11. JCspartan2

    JCspartan2 Sparty Party

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    I'm in agreement with Hova on this one, I dont think its cheese. To me it looks like he waits in the pocket to pass and then takes off. If your dropping everyone back in man coverage that allows you to get burned by the QB running. Hova is right and if you would have called a spy, contain, or even something like cover 3 this doesn't happen. The danger of man coverage is that you can get burned by things like a QB running or a screen play.

    As for the 4th down. That call should have totally been up to you. It's a huge risk on your part and could have worked out more in favor of Gators than yourself. I understand that punting in that situation doesn't do you a lot of good, especially if you've had a lot of trouble stopping him. I probably would have gone for it too so I see no problem with that one.
     
  12. GoGators

    GoGators GT: KSherm

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    I'm going to try to keep this as constructive as possible, but calling somebody out for cheese is pretty shady in my book. I've been a member here for almost two years now and not once have I had anybody complain about my gameplay. Also, the comment that I complain about everybody else's gameplay is absolutely bullshit. So before statements like that are made, please obtain some facts before slandering me. I've never complained about someone's specific gameplay (besides one guy and if you were in the commish forums, you know who that was). Now on with the situation at hand.

    The facts:

    Tom Richardson is a dual threat QB.
    His stats for the game:
    9 carries 65 yds, TD
    15/22, 232 yds.

    Of the 9 carries, 3 were sacks, 2 were designed runs (QB power and speed option for a 20 yd TD) and 4 scrambles. If you consider he had 29 dropbacks (22 attempts + 3 sacks + 4 scrambles) and ran on 4 of them, that's 14% scrambling. For a running QB, I don't think it's that bad.

    I'm being accused of calling streaks and just looking to run with my QB. I'm sure everybody that has ever played me can vouch for the fact that that is not, nor has it ever been part of my gameplan.

    The situation:

    FSU played cover 2 press defense 99% of the time. I felt like I was playing Madden `06 or `07, the first year they implemented the show blitz feature and that's all anybody did online was cram the box with all 11 guys. This is what FSU did. It wasn't a Dime Cover 2 press call, it was the coverage audible nearly every play to bring the safeties up. The safeties were walked up inside 10 yards nearly every play.

    Now I hit slants, drags, curls, and deep drags in the game. However, let's go with Dakota's argument that I didn't call man to man beaters. If that's the case, who tries to throw short man beating routes when there's 11 in the box? Nobody, there's no space in there. So, you are forced to try and go over the top. Unfortunately for me, my guys weren't able to beat the press coverage and spent half the time locked up at the LOS. On all of those runs, it was largely due to my first read being stuck in press coverage, which you can't really see since the camera angle only shows the backfield.

    The next argument is that I didn't sit in the pocket and only looked to run right away. That couldn't be further from the truth and the videos clearly show I set up in the pocket and made my reads. But let's do the math. If FSU rushes 3 and drops 8 and I have 4 guys in routes, that leaves me with every man being double covered. I'm suppose to sit in the pocket and wait for someone to break open from double coverage??? I'd also like to point out that FSU already has a shutdown corner in Greg Reid so even in single coverage w/o help, he's able to take away half the field.

    Also, the last time I checked, this is college football and a dual threat QB is suppose to be a weapon. It's the defenses job to account for his threat to pull it down and run at anytime. As others have pointed out, perhaps there should of been some different defensive play calls to account for this.

    Also I'd like to point out that there were a handful of occasions where straight up pass commit was called. Now, I know the rule in place is that this is allowed on occasion, but add pass commit to 8 guys already dropping back in coverage and where am I suppose to throw the ball?

    As for the 4th down, yes I did message about if he was going to go for it. I loosely quote "There's 6 minutes left in the 4th quarter in a 5 pt game, you have 3 timeouts left, and you're on your own side of the field, are you really going for it?" To which I got the response "yeah, I might just run with my QB". Now it's my mistake that I thought the rule in place was you had to be down 2 scores in the 4th to go for it on your own side of the field. I thought it was under 3 minutes before you could go for it from anywhere. It could of easily been explained that you felt there was a reason to go for it and this would of been avoided.

    And not to cry over spilled milkshake here but calling me out for throwing the ball to Demps an exaggerated 10 times in season 1 is just rude. He may have caught a decent amount of balls in that game but it wasn't 10. However, if I recall correctly, it was largely due to the same defense you played last night. Cover 2 press with you roaming the middle w/the MLB who should of been covering the HB. So I'd dump to Demps and he'd chew ya up since I didn't have a mobile QB. But I guess I'm suppose to throw into double coverage against FSU.

    However, the real reason you lost in season 1 wasn't due to Demps, it was due to all the false start penalties I got off you since you had jump snap on for plenty of key situations. Just like it was in the first quarter last night.
     
  13. Hova

    Hova Live Action. YiYiYi!

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    We can simplify this with one question for whoever is making the rules around here..

    When CAN you run with the QB? Do you really have to sit in the pocket for an extended amount of time if there is a huge hole to run through?
     
  14. dakota7

    dakota7 Former Blue Chip Recruit

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    I didn't use aggressive dline at all last night.

    Talk about slander, I was not in cover 2 99% of the time. Prove that.

    I used pass commit when I was "sure" you were passing.
     
  15. GoGators

    GoGators GT: KSherm

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    Well I've never seen anybody elses user controlled team jump offsides so I guess you're guys are just overly aggressive on fake snaps.

    Maybe it wasn't 99% cover 2, there was some cover 1s and other stuff in there. But it was man to man press coverage 99% of the time.

    And I'm sure you used pass commit when I didn't pass, but we'll just never know now will we?
     
  16. dakota7

    dakota7 Former Blue Chip Recruit

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    Of course I used pass commit when you didn't actually pass. Anytime you use it its a guess. And Yes, I play mostly man. I prefer it. But I didn't use Cover 2 press all the time. I mix cover 1 and 0 and some zone packages. But if you come out in trips I audible into man. Of course. How did a thread about using pass plays as running plays become about my defensive gameplan.
     
  17. dakota7

    dakota7 Former Blue Chip Recruit

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    I'd like to stop this right here. Gators, you're a good dude. I'm sure you weren't intentionally trying to fuck me. But the bottom line here is I think you were doing something wrong and you don't. So the question is, how do we agree on a solution?
     
  18. Shaun Mason

    Shaun Mason Somebody you used to know.

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    Again, I don't have an issue with the running Gators did. I had a play where I did the exact same thing against Suge in The Game.

    But, for resolution sake...do we need a league vote?
     
  19. Randiesel75

    Randiesel75 Walk On

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    I have no issues either. I think the best bet is to toss it up to a league vote then mandate the outcome (if applicable).
     
  20. dakota7

    dakota7 Former Blue Chip Recruit

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    I guess this is more my problem than it is anyone else's. I'm a big boy, I can handle that. Gators...........I'm sorry.

    But so I can get some piece of mind, because QB scrambling is a recurring issue for me..........what is acceptable and what isn't?
     
  21. Big Suge Knight

    Big Suge Knight Walk On

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    Very true. I want the game thrown out and Michigan to be awarded the Big Ten and BCS titles. J/K

    I do not have a problem with Shaun or Gators play. I prob have the most mobile QB and I try to hang in there prob too long to avoid issues. But realistic play would have clock go off in your QBs head and he would get out of there. How about the three Mississippi count from the sandlot.
     
  22. Hova

    Hova Live Action. YiYiYi!

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    I'm tellin you all you have to do is run a simple contain and this will never be an issue again, guys usually stop trying to run instantly when they see that because it doesn't turn out well.

    I switch to a contain the very next play after a QB gets a run on me
     
  23. JCspartan2

    JCspartan2 Sparty Party

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    You don't even have to call contain, you can call zone plays like cover 3 or cover 2 and they wont be able to do that as easily either because you have corners in the flats and lbs over the middle sitting in their zones.
     
  24. Randiesel75

    Randiesel75 Walk On

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    I agree, Cover-2 is my favorite play against a mobile QB and someone who exploits the open flats.
     
  25. GoGators

    GoGators GT: KSherm

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    I agree u don't want this going any further. If you play man to man all the time and drop your linebackers this is really all that your leaving open for the offense.

    I use the air raid in the deuce and have spent time studying this offense and reading excerpts from Norm Chows playbook reads. My gameplan follows his philosophy, know who your reading and working off every play. Make your read and throw. If the defense doesn't give you a read and covers everything, tuck and run and live to play another down.

    The key things that determine cheese in my book is if you run right away or all the time. Also, rolling out to break down the coverage is a no no.
     

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