Vince Young

Discussion in 'The Cheap Seats' started by GoGators, Nov 24, 2009.

  1. GoGators

    GoGators GT: KSherm

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    Vince Young

    How sick was he last night? He looked like the Rose Bowl where he just couldn't be stopped. I especially liked Gruden's comment about Cushing (former USC LB) who still hasn't been able to tackle him, referencing last night and the Rose Bowl.

    What did you guys think of him running the option and the zone read successfully? Do you think we'll see more of that in the future with more and more spread QBs available in the draft?
     
  2. jmillhimes

    jmillhimes Walk On

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    As a Texan fan, Im sick of people saying we should have taken him instead of Mario Williams. Vince Young looks great but thats because he has some serious help in the back field with Chris Johnson.

    The Texans beat themselves last night. Robinson dropped a sure pick and Brown could not kick for shit.

    I am not sold on Vince Young. Remember McNabb and Vick? Running QB's who started getting injured left and right. Young has not yet mastered sitting in the pocket and being on target. If he gets this down, then I would be sold.

    The Titans are crazy if they build around Young. Dont be surprised if VY has a solid finish and someone offers the Titans some serious picks for his services.

    As for Cushing, he needs to learn to tackle instead of just hit. The guy has a shot at being the Defensive Rookie Of The Year and can only get better
     
  3. Lee.Flex

    Lee.Flex Ducks Fan

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    I think he did good. He was exciting to watch, and paired up with Chris Johnson, it is going to be hard for any team to stop. I think the biggest thing for him right now is - "Don't make Mistakes!" He didn't last night and the Titans came out with a win. He showed he can play smart and go through his progressions. He also didn't go for the big play on 3rd down late in the 4th.... he passed the ball underneath to the open WR, and gave the FG kicker a chance.
     
  4. GoGators

    GoGators GT: KSherm

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    Jmill, you're obviously still bitter haha.

    I know he's not ever going to be a superstar like he was in college. He'll never be as great as a leader, even in a different way, as Manning and Brady are. But, he was really good last night.

    By him being really good last night I mean sort of in the way that Tebow is good at UF. No, Tebow doesn't have the best arm. No he isn't the fastest. No he isn't always making the right reads. But he is almost always converting them 3rd and 4's that keep the drives going and keep the defense on the sidelines resting. That's been the biggest change to the Titans I think.

    They give it to CJ on 1st and 2nd down hoping he breaks it. (He had like 30 carries last night), then on 3rd and medium, VY finds a way to get the first down. It's complete small ball, but it works.

    I wondered why the Texans didn't just bring 8 guys every play though. I think a QB like that, you make him get rid of the ball quick and take your chances in one on one coverage with an inaccurate passer.

    But the other question/topic we missed, is what about the option??? They ran it really effectively last night. Do you see that happening more in the NFL?
     
  5. Newb Slice

    Newb Slice Walk On

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    i thought it was funny when he scrambled out to the right and threw the TD pass because if that happened in madden everyone would be calling the user a cheeser
     
  6. MaxATX34

    MaxATX34 Texas Football

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    (remember that I am a die-hard Texas Longhorns fan before you read this)

    I dont think we'll see more of it. VY is probably the only QB on earth that could run it at the NFL level. I would say Vick but I dont think he is as durable as Young. No one wants to go head-up with Vince and he is a make-you-miss runner anyway and he avoids the big hits. Come to think of it I cant ever remember seeing Young get blasted on...

    As for Young's passing... last night he looked pretty damn good throwing the ball. I forgot how strong his arm is and how quick of a release he has. I dont think you can compare Tebow to him at all in that area. Tebow needs to completely re-work his mechanics if he is going to make it at the NFL level. Im not saying VY has good mechanics or anything, but he has a quick release and a perfect spiral... good touch on the long ball too and he makes throwing on the run look easy. Also, he stayed in the effing pocket last night and was moving his eyes around the field which was a glorious sight to this fan.

    What makes VY a viable option at QB is what he does to defenses. When he starts to move, in or out of the pocket, the LBs MUST react or get burned which opens up the medium passing routes as evidenced by his TD toss to Britt. I dont think Tebow is fast enough to be a running threat at the NFL level, but that is just me. The Texans dared Young to throw and he did, pretty well... when the Texans switched things up he took advantage which is one sign of a good QB. And of course... having C.J. as your RB helps a lot haha.

    as far as him being a leader I think everyone underestimates him in that area a lot and as Texas fan it is almost comical to hear that that isnt one of his strengths. I can only imagine the difference in the locker room between having Collins at QB and VY at QB. Seriously who on that offense could relate to Collins? And if youve ever played football you know that the culture/tone/mood/attitude in the locker room almost directly translates to on the field performance. I made a post about this exact point on OS when VY was on the bench and I dont mean to say i told you so but...

    :D
     
  7. MaxATX34

    MaxATX34 Texas Football

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    Colt McCoy is a cheeser too lol. IRL its called extending the play. In video games its kraft cheesey macaroni haha.
     
  8. Dj391

    Dj391 Walk On

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    I always thought VY was a good qb in the nfl its not about stats its about wins and that man knows how to WIN flat out, he finds a way in every game to win or put his team in a position to win a game thats evident from his w/l in the nfl and college and high school hes done it at all levels i never thought he shoulda been benched for kerry collins even though the titans tore it up during the regular season with him i think if they woulda put VY back in when he healed up it woulda created even more wins because of wat he does to defenses....As evidence in the playoff loss to baltimore they shut down the run and made collins try to win the game i think Vince woulda done so being hes dangerous as a runner also, collins not so much lol
     
  9. GoGators

    GoGators GT: KSherm

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    My comparison to Tebow was in relation to what Tebow has done in college. He just always find a way to convert that 3rd and 4. That's what VY did last night that was so crucial to their success.

    I agree VY is a one of a kind. Tebow isn't nearly as fast and with how he's played this year, he definitely will struggle in the NFL. At the same time though the guys got the competitive fire just like VY so who knows. Either way, he needs good coaching to play at that level.

    VY will never run his team like Manning or Brady does is what I meant. He won't light up the scoreboard by reading and dissecting defenses. He may however dice them up based on his pure athletic ability. But he'll never be as technical as those two guys.

    He can play small ball though and that's what football is all about, moving the chains. 4 downs to go 10 yards.

    He did get lucky though when he threw that jump ball on the corner route and the Texans CB showed why he plays defense and not offense as it bounced right off his hands.

    As for the option, I think you could see it more. I think given the opportunity, Pat White could potentially do what VY did last night. Also, as for durability, I read an article about it before in ESPN magazine. The issue before was no one wanted their $50M a year QB getting knocked out for the season running the ball because they didn't have a capable backup.

    Now though, there's tons of college QBs that can run the spread. So if your QB depth chart looked like:
    VY
    Vick
    McCoy

    just for the sake of argument, all 3 could run the same offense well. If one goes down the other can step in and make similar plays. Wouldn't that be interesting?
     
  10. MaxATX34

    MaxATX34 Texas Football

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    I agree with everything you have said.

    Pat white did cross my mind too. He could work... perhaps might need to add a little more mass to do it every week though.

    If youre talking about Colt McCoy there at the end... Im not sure how effective he would be running the ball in the NFL. dont get me wrong he could scramble and pick up yards, but i dont think defenses would have to scheme to stop it. If he is your 3rd option for that though that wouldnt be so bad.

    I think Colt McCoy would work out perfectly in a system like New England's to be honest. Colt's best attribute is accuracy in the short/medium pass game, and with that and his mobility (at least compared to brady's) I think he could be very successful there. Sitting on the bench behind Brady for a few seasons would be good for any rookie QB though heh. and there is a little history there with NE inviting Applewhite out to camp so who knows... not sure if he will fall far enough or if NE will spend that high a draft pick on him though. They need a younger defense first and foremost.
     
  11. BDSDIGITAL

    BDSDIGITAL One Time for your Mind

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    I loved the option plays they ran last night with Young and Johson. Good timing on the play calls and alot of speed to the edge. It makes them that much more dynamic on offense.
     
  12. Drifterbub

    Drifterbub Help me hide a body?

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    Because much like the Texans secondary, the Madden defensive AI is retarded.


    Time will tell us what kind of player VY is. I think he's been too inconsistent to really show anyone anything.

    I really find it hard to believe that McCoy can be succesful in the NFL. He's not very big and his arm strength is really going to hurt him come time for individual workouts. Everyone thought the same thing of Graham Harrell (accurate passer with an average arm), but his workouts were poor. I would like to think Colt is a bit more of a workhorse, but I don't think his work ethic and desire take him much further than the bench in the NFL.
     
  13. MaxATX34

    MaxATX34 Texas Football

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    Colt is 6'3 220lbs and when he gets on those NFL roids im sure he'll be closer to 230. Colt is absolutely insane in practice so I'd be willing to wager his stock will rise after workouts.

    I never thought Harrell would work out in the NFL. His footwork was non-existent and the way Leach breaks down the passing game for his QBs is totally different than any pro-style offense, spread or not. I think his footwork though is what really killed his chances. There were plenty of great QBs that didnt have a cannon arm.

    Colt has the arm strength to play in the league though. He threw a ball off his back foot that went 50yds in the air and landed on a dime against Tech last year. Yea that was one play but its there... Texas offense just utilizes the WR's ball skills and the short game to substitute for their lack of a run-game(at least that would make sense haha).
    Put it this way... when Colt does throw downfield I dont cringe or anything. In any case, looking at his skill set, I think he has a better shot to be successful than VY and VY has a very good W/L record as a starter as of right now.

    Remember, Im biased as hell here lol

    Edit: and I feel like we've had this conversation before hahaha
     
  14. Dj391

    Dj391 Walk On

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    colt mccoys role at texas the way the offense is ran is just like tom bradys with the patriots prior to them getting moss lol
     
  15. Drifterbub

    Drifterbub Help me hide a body?

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    Yeah, we have had this conversation before, lol. Remember that I told you that Colt won't measure at 6'3'' 220 at the combine? I'll be shocked if he's close.

    His arm strength isn't NFL caliber. I've watched him play, A LOT. His arm strength will be a limiting factor.
     
  16. GoGators

    GoGators GT: KSherm

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    You don't cringe because in the Big 12, your WR's are always open by 20 yds on every play. When you actually played a decent defense against OU, he wasn't quite as effective.

    I really think it's hard to project QB's at good programs to the NFL. It's so much different to go from a premiere college where in 80% of the games you play, the defense doesn't have one guy that would play on your team and is completely outmatched by your offensive talent. To the NFL where everybody is even and exceptionally talented.

    I'd argue it's why these no name guys succeed in the NFL (i'm using the term no name loosely). Take Jay Cutler, for 4 years every week he played against a defense that was better than his offense. Or Tom Brady, he rode the pine and ran the scout team for 3 years at U of M. So every day he took guys that weren't good enough to start and played against the starters. It's that experience that creates a great player. Not playing where everyone on your team is better than everyone on the other team.
     
  17. jmillhimes

    jmillhimes Walk On

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    Yes Gators, Im pissed at the Texans. As I said, they beat themselves. Coach Kubiak does not take chances very much. I also feel to many players on this team are overrated.

    As for VY. Dont forget that this is just a few games he has progressed in. I do wish him the best but I still think he needs to bring more to the table and be known just for scrambling. He did show signs of being a good Passer last night but the Texans dropped 3 interceptions and most teams wont do that.

    I kinda wanna see the Titans rebound from the year they were having. With all this talent, they should not be lying flat down
     
  18. MaxATX34

    MaxATX34 Texas Football

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    I dont think OU's defense is awesome this year or anything. I think Texas had plenty of chances to put that game away early but didnt because of Colt making mistakes.
    did you see/hear how sick Colt was after the OU game this year? he could barely talk. he was looking pretty bad on all fronts during the first half of the season. He has since turned it around and completed 80% of his passes over the last 5 games. that is hard to do standing still in the backyard let alone against any type of defense.
     
  19. Drifterbub

    Drifterbub Help me hide a body?

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    It helps when you have a guy like Shipley who can run through a rain storm and come out dry.
     
  20. MaxATX34

    MaxATX34 Texas Football

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    No doubt about that.

    Last year he had Quan Cosby too who is/was better than Shipley. I think that is the main reason his numbers are down from last year to be honest. Cant wait to see what he can do a squad of NFL wide-outs and a legit Tight End.:)
     
  21. GoGators

    GoGators GT: KSherm

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    Don't forget it'll be against a squad of legit CBs, Safeties, and a much more talented defensive coordinator to gameplan against him.

    I'm not sold on Colt in the NFL. Great college QB no doubt. Just not sure how he'll project. The arm strength looks skeptical, but who knows.

    I don't care how sick he was after the OU game. Did he have swine flu like half the SEC has had this year? If it's an excuse, don't play.

    I'm just not sold on him because his WR's are always wide open and he always has all day to throw it. That won't be the case at the next level, not even close.

    Going to an earlier discussion, someone who could truly replicate what VY is doing in the NFL by running an option attack....Jake Locker. Just as fast, just as big if not stronger, and maybe a stronger arm, not sure though.
     
  22. MaxATX34

    MaxATX34 Texas Football

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    Big as vince? yes.
    Strong as vince? maybe, but i doubt it.
    stronger arm? maybe... Locker probably has better mechanics.
    Faster? no way in hell haha :p

    I love Locker's game, but he doesnt have VY type game-speed.

    Could he replicate what VY is doing in the NFL though? Yea I could see that.
     

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