what WE think is/isn't cheese thread

Discussion in 'Thread Archive' started by MurkYa21, Jul 30, 2009.

  1. MurkYa21

    MurkYa21 Walk On

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    what WE think is/isn't cheese thread

    Im having a hard time getting us together to do this on AIM so we will just do it on here. If you aren't semi active, I am going to get pissed, and I will find a replacement if need be. (that's only if I feel you absolutely don't give a shit.)

    • sportsmanship
      - try not to run up the score...so on and so forth
    • standing up DEs/pass rushing
      - how do we feel about this? I don't do it, but I've seen people who like to stand up their DE's...not to play coverage, but to blitz..does anyone want to make a case for this?
    • clock management
      - use chew the clock if you are winning...don't call pointless T.O.s (/convo)
    • hb at fb
      - NO fb dives with a hb, but it is okay to use a formation sub and put one there for other plays.
    • play action on 3rd and long
      - I saw newbslice do it. be realistic on situations like this. A team is not going to play action on 3rd and 15. You may call a PA play however and hot route the halfback to block.
    • scrambling
      - I would like to add a new rule, that if there is no pressure you can not sprint to the side of the field. It is okay to go out of the pocket, but you must walk. Obviously, if there is pressure you can sprint.
    • pre snap defense
      - Make sure we are only moving around the player that we are using for that play pre snap. You can still hot route defenders, shift d line, shift olbs, etc.
    • qb sneak
      - Should this be okay this year? or just leave it out? I think we'll be fine with out it



    While we are on the topic:
    • game summaries
      - please keep posting
    • communication
      - so far the communication has been great by most of you guys. especially when setting up games.
    • scouting report
      - remember to keep your info updated, and to fill out a report on people you've played if you find the time.
    • advancing
      - right now, we are moving pretty fast. I move in Aug 12...Im playing football, so my time will be very limited. At that point, we will be moving back to two times a week.



      this is all I could think of at the moment...feel free to add on.
     
  2. The Parrothead

    The Parrothead Walk On

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    In regards to the chew clock, you say "if you're winning." I don't think we should put a specific number on it (if you're winning by 2 and there's 4 minutes left, you may still want to get a drive going since the CPU becomes an all-time greatest team every now and then). I'd say just use some common sense.

    Agree with everything else. Also, to help things out, no FCS teams anymore. I don't think the game will schedule them, but just in case...
     
  3. BDSDIGITAL

    BDSDIGITAL One Time for your Mind

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    My opinions if anyone gives a shit:

    standing up de's is kinda bullshit to blitz, that's what olb are for. If you're going to blitz like that you should have to take someone out of coverage.

    Parrothead is 100% right on this one. Since the cpu qb morphs into Joe Montana with wheels in the last 4 minutes you have to be careful when you run the clock, or you just might not have any time left after they inevitably score in the last minute. I know what you mean though Murk and you're absolutely right.

    I'm not really cool with the hb at fb for playaction and such, but I'm not going to cry about it either.

    I would take exception to the qb scrambling/walking idea only for bootlegs and rollouts. But those are designed plays to break the pocket so I'm sure that's ok.

    I agree with the pre snap defense suggestion

    I like to run a sneak on 3rd/4th and inches occasionally but it's pretty rare and it's the falling down variety when I do. I haven't run one this season actually that I can remember. I think it should be an option but the fall for 1/2 yard variety, only when it would be acceptable in real life. It's a realistic call in some cases. I won't cry about this one either.

    I also agree no more FCS teams if avoidable. That was two hours of my life I'll never get back. j/k

    Most of this isn't really a big deal to me though...just play football how it was meant to be played I guess. dropping back 15 yards is the ncaa 09 classic pat white cheese move and shouldn't be tolerated.
     
  4. MurkYa21

    MurkYa21 Walk On

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    as far as FCS teams go...they were only on the schedule because we agreed to keep the schedules the same. That obviously saved us a lot of trouble, because a lot of people were having to re do their schedules.


    I'm not talking about play action on that QB walking/scrambling rule. Im just saying, on a standard pass, the only time you sprint is if you are about to get sacked.
     
  5. MurkYa21

    MurkYa21 Walk On

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    • No huddle
      - How do we feel about this being used as an offense?
      I think it is cheese when you use it because someone is in the wrong D...or you run a play and get 10 yards because they didn't have the right play called, but I think if no huddle is your primary offense ..and you are using a passing attack it may be okay. What do you guys think?
     
  6. mcyork

    mcyork Walk On

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    I have a no huddle offense but I don't like to use it that often only under 2 min in half or at the end of the game. Really I think cheesing is when you take advantage of an AI flaw. The hurry up offense can be detrimental to you against the computer. They adjust pretty well this year. A few of my picks have been at the end of the half or when I have been down at the end of the game and I am playing from behind. Against users now I don't know about that. I think I can live without the hurry up so what I am saying is that if we made it only to be used at certain times of the game ie end of halfs only if behind by more than 14 I could live with that. How about we look at on the roll outs I like to pump fake and then look down field if nothing is their I then look for a lane and sprint out of the pocket this gives the play time to develop and my receivers time to run their routes. I don't see that as cheese does anyone else?
     
  7. MurkYa21

    MurkYa21 Walk On

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    There is already a rule in place for the hurry up. Under 2 minutes during the 1st/2nd half, or when losing in the 4th.

    As far as sprinting out, I think it is pretty much cheese. Why do you need to sprint out if there is no pressure. It breaks down the AI...it's stupid. just my opinion though.


    this is what I am referring to as cheese -
    [YOUTUBE]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/FJ5ZhU6Kb-4&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/FJ5ZhU6Kb-4&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/YOUTUBE]
     
  8. mcyork

    mcyork Walk On

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    Murk I think that your video is borderline cheese. In years past you would take your QB run straight back and then go out around your pocket to give you more time. In the video the QB waited in the pocket it looked like the pocket was breaking down he started to move up in the pocket he found a hole and escaped to the right. On deep routes you have to give your WR time to make a move sometimes that means moving outside the pocket. IMO
     
  9. MaxATX34

    MaxATX34 Texas Football

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    -I think overuse, of anything, is what irritates me the most.
    -As far as sprinting out. I have no problem with it as long as you stay in the pocket until it collapses. However, if you do that 5 times a quarter i would consider that cheese.
    -Taking the snap and immediately sprinting to the sideline is cheese though. try to make the game look realistic.
    -Using the same play over and over is cheese.
    -Running no huddle ALL game is cheese. If you want to run a no-huddle drive here and there though I wouldnt have a problem with that.
    -The reason I say no huddle all game is cheese is because it is not the same as a real-life no huddle offense. A real life no-huddle offense still has to look over at the sideline and get the plays from the coaches... its not as instant as in 2010. so if you are gong to run a no huddle offense against a user, give them a few seconds before you snap it (im assuming the no-huddle offense will be changing their plays also, so there should be at least little time for the D to adjust. I just dont like playing against a no-huddle, same play, drive all the way down the field. ugh that is not football to me)
    -Quarters defense. I would say the only time this should be used is on 3rd and long in the 4th quarter when your opponent has 4 or 5 WR out and you are winning.
     
  10. MurkYa21

    MurkYa21 Walk On

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    I pretty much agree with everything you said.

    By no huddle, I certainly did not mean running the same play. And yes, you would have to let the defense get set. you wouldn't have to let them make a ton of adjustments, but you wouldnt be able to purposefully catch people offsides or snap it until the players stopped moving.

    Anything used over and over, like you said, is cheese.

    I feel the same way on the QB scrambling..
     
  11. MorsDraconis

    MorsDraconis Walk On

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    I'm sorry, but it's my feeling that the above video posted by Murk is most definitely cheese. There was no pressure at all on the QB. The only pressure was created by the QB rolling to the right after the snap. If you stay in the pocket and even more so step up into the pocket, there is absolutely NO reason to sprint out like that.

    It's my feeling that if the play isn't specifically designed to roll out or it isn't a option pass play, there's no reason to sprint out of the pocket and not just run the ball.

    It's cheese, plain and simple and ESPECIALLY so when you've got a curl route called because the AI is retarded and leaves his man before you cross the line of scrimmage to pass the ball.
     
  12. BDSDIGITAL

    BDSDIGITAL One Time for your Mind

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    agree 100%
     
  13. mcyork

    mcyork Walk On

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    Ok you guys disagree with me thats fine I think we are looking at this the wrong way. Not what is cheese and what isn't but what do we do when one of our members is called out. I think that if I am playing a game against a user and he makes the same move as the video above I would not call him out unless it became repetative. If he does this over and over every play just to get an advantage. Then I would call foul. I don't record the games and you would have to replay it for me to tell you if he ran out of the pocket before he was pressured. I really don't have time for that. I take my lumps and move on. I have stated this before we are in this to have fun and play with people who like this game as much as we do. Why do we have to judge how we are playing?
     
  14. MurkYa21

    MurkYa21 Walk On

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    I think, like said by two other people now, if something is being used repeatedly that is borderline cheese, it has now became a problem and should be addressed.

    mcyork - we're just trying to avoid complications...im aware that probably half of you read through the rules...we're just clearing shit up, so when it happens there should be no excuses.
     
  15. RageRoolz

    RageRoolz Guest

    I have read the rules and really feel they hardly need to be tweak.however, i do feel the qb sneak rule should be revoked.if we are trying to be a realistic league, why handcuff the coaches and remove a play?this year it was been toned down so much it isnt cheese at all. It isnt automatic like years past.
     
  16. MorsDraconis

    MorsDraconis Walk On

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    I agree, but I'm also to the point where what's the point of using it at all? It's terrible. Why do that when you can just go I-from or goalline and run it right at them with your HB?
     
  17. Newb Slice

    Newb Slice Walk On

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    I really dont see how running a PA on 3rd and long is cheese with the formation i was in. I was running the heck out of the ball with like 35 rushes that game to 14 passes 2 of which that were picked. I set up the PA by coming out in a 2 WR set as if i was running the ball again, i did a fake butt pat to act like i was switching the running side. He was using his safety and he took the bait by running up with his safety which free'd my TE due to no help over the top to me that is just a good play call

    I could see coming out in a 4 wr set and doing a play action but i set the play up pretty much the whole game
     
  18. MurkYa21

    MurkYa21 Walk On

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    Something I was meaning to get to..

    If you are running it all game, sure. fine.

    sack tapper
     
  19. 1ke

    1ke D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

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    Max...you stole the words right outta my mouth. I agree. Just play the game as closely to how it would be played on Saturdays. Thats how I feel.
     
  20. 1ke

    1ke D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

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    For the record, I was in there too, I didnt see anything being abused or considered full blown cheese. If a user is using his free saftey, an bites on a PA, whos fault is that?
     

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